I know this subject has come up over and again over the years, and there are many threads on the subject. I've read through most of them, starting with TechoWeenie's thread. Unfortunately all his orginal pictures and diagrams no longer link correctly. So, I am at a loss.

The idea of having a kill switch was inspired by BOCs chips, where, when you had multiple programs on a single chip, you were sent a switch which also had the added functionality of an engine kill switch. Unfortunately, with my current car, I went with the flash tool over the chip being ever present under my dash. So now I'm going to try doing it on my own.

My past experience with vehicle electronics generally resulted in much cursing and mutilated finger tips, so I wasn't anxious to just start hacking things up and hoping for the best. Ideally, the set up I've imagined is a three-way switch (on-off-rocker on). I'd like it so that when it's on, the key cranks the engine normally, and doesn't crank when it's off. I'd like to use the rocker as a sort of push-to-start button, so that when the key is in the run position, it acts as a secondary ignition switch (i.e. I can use the rocker switch to engage the starter circuit).

I'm trying to work it out in my head, but I'm no electrician. I'm guessing a simple on/off switch could basically be spliced into the starter circuit at the ignition cylinder. But for the rocker functionality, the switch would have to have a live lead when the key is in the run position, so that when the switch is "rocked" the current drives the starter circuit.

So my question is (finally): Is it as simple as running the "hot" side of the starter circuit on to two of the posts on the switch, and using the third post as the connection that would then run to the starter? Obviously I don't want the button to start the car without the key.

Any help would be much appreciated (and diagrams, idiot proof if possible haha). I'm not a complete dunce with these things, I used to repair electric guitars, and have run custom accent lighting in a couple of my cars, just nothing with such specific requirements. I'll be happy to post up all the pictures of the process if I can get this done.

Thanks

-Daniel

What type of switch are you planning on using? I'm not vastly familiar with 3 position rockers. You could use a DPDT switch in a OFF/ON/Start but you would have to switch out once it gets started so you don't overrun and damage the starter. The difficulty I guess of what you're asking is for part hard throw, part rocker, but I don't know that those exist. Do they? If not it could always be accomplished with 2 separate switches, one SPST and one rocker. Let me know if this switch exists and I'll draw it up for you.

EDIT: I reread your post again. It sounds like what you want all this to do in a single switch you may have to also use a relay.

Yeah I may have dreamt up an ideal switch. All I seem to be able to find are on/off/on or momentary/off/momentary, not a combination of the two (momentary on/off/on).

I like this switch set up because I can set it to ON anytime someone needs to use the car (valet mode; like that ever happens). OFF setting is just for piece of mind for me, seeing as the CVPIs have no anti-theft mechanisms whatsoever, and I've already had someone get in and rummage through all my junk. Then I figure it's cleaner to have the push to start function in the same switch rather than cluttering up my dash.

found this:
http://www.amazon.com/DPDT-Momentary-On-Off-Momentary-Rocker-Switch/dp/B001PNO4OE never mind, not it

So I suppose then I would have to use a switch to open/close the ignition circuit, and one next to it be the momentary rocker switch I use to actually crank the engine?

As far as the switch, you need an (ON)- OFF - ON switch

You'll have three posts, a common, and two poles.

I've seen on-off-momentary switches. But it would be greatly simplified I think with a off-on-momentary and I don't know if THOSE exist.

That way you could wire the ignition, or "run" in series with the key, and the "start" circuit in parallel. That would be cake to wire and do everything you want it to do.

• Off would be OFF - nothing happens at the key and complete system disable because the "run" circuit is interrupted by the first switch in series. Accessory position would still work
• On at the switch would ready the car as normal and send power to the key in the "run" position in series.
• Since the starter circuit is wired in parallel it becomes an either/or start function with the key in the car. You could start the car with either the key or the switch, but only when the key is present and in the "run" position, completing the series circuit at the second break. Without the key in the car, the momentary start would not work because of the break in the series circuit.

But if you want the ign. on and momentary start on opposite sides of the switch, I don't know you would wire the ign. without another component. Cause as soon as you release the momentary switch it's going to return to OFF. So you can't just series the ignition. You can't even parallel the ignition cause you want to be able to cut and kill it. It gets a bit more complicated.

You're overthinking it.

You don't kill IGNITION, which is actually about 5 wires, you're killing STARTER, which is a single wire...

It's only 5 wires when you don't know which wire you're supposed to use. Four out of those 5 wires only control accessories and systems that are hot in "run". There's only one IGNITION wire in the "run" position. I was trying to come up with something that did what the OP was asking to do, and it's still simpler than what you posted.

I said in my first post, a relay would have to be used. Which is what you did. It's just more complicated than what I had I mind. There's more than one way to kill a cat car.

Apparently you're not familiar with the ignition system.

Many wires, may seemingly '[censored]', are actually needed.. One 'accessory wire' actually controls the alternator... So go ahead and ignore 'accessory' and try to keep your car running.... See how fast it kills the battery..

So, first of all, there are TWO wires, that are the same color, that are ignition, and BOTH are 50A, so please tell me how you plan on switching a 50A+ load, with a simple (on) off ON switch without a relay..

That's what I thought.

Learn, THEN talk.

I've done more remote start/ keep running/ ignition bypasses on JUST panthers, than you've probably done on any other vehicles combined.

Have you completely removed an ignition, bypassed PATS, had NO key for the ignition, and turned it into a push button on/off with push button start?

Didn't think so.

I have.



^^^^ Watch the video

Thanks, but you forgot to ask me if I wanted a pamphlet.

I figured I schooled you enough for one day, and didn't wanna confuse you with too much information...

Now stop crapping in this guys thread, I posted the info he needed. If you have another idea to post, then post it, but make sure it's accurate.

Hooking up a switch to a 50A feed is not a good option. In addition, your standard relays are SPDT 30/40A, which is not rated for the 50A feed. You'd need heavy duty relays... There's a reason why those lines, while 'the same', are fed from two different wires...



He could even just have a simple on/off switch for the fuel pump relay trigger..... that'd be more effective than anything, really.

Try one of these, they are less than $100.00.

Tremco Antitheft System http://www.tremcopoliceproducts.com/index.html

Quite a setup Techno. You might appreciate this vid I came across in my research today, if only for the fact that he seems as passionate about what he does as you seem to be. Plus, I'm a geek and always dug this in the transporter, so I'll post it for that reason, too.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FbF3p1950lw&feature=related



Alright, looking at this, you have the ON post wired to 85 on relay; the START wire hot side to 30; 86 ground (can I ground this to chassis?); and the (now) dead side START wire is run to 89 and tapped to also run to the (ON) post. Is this correct?

Sorry if it's obvious and I'm missing it, but I've been working 12 hour shifts the last couple days. Where does the 12V+ come from that connects to the center post of the switch? Would this be a tap of the hot RUN wire from the ignition cylinder?

I was also wondering about what prodigalson mentioned after I logged off earlier. Will this kill the car when I go from (ON) to OFF to ON? Or is that moot because we're using the START wire instead of the RUN wire?

Thanks for all the quick help guys. And thanks davkenrem, I looked into some similar things, but nothing satisfies you like doing it yourself.

-Daniel

Bad idea.. See that exposed wiring? All it takes is a knife and you've bypassed it.



Yes. In off position, there is no power to the relay, meaning it won't trigger. When in the ON position, it has power, and the ignition wire is the trigger, so your ignition will work. When you hit the 'start' position, it will bypass your ignition switch altogether, and trigger the starter all by itself, no need to even twist the key to 'start', just 'run'..



Yes, you need to make sure you get a hot in run/start, if you tap into a hot in run, SOME are hot in run/accesory but cut OUT in start, to make sure that all available juice is for the starter, and no sensitive electronics are damaged during cranking (low voltage).



Moot point because it's the starter wire, not the IGNITION hot in run wireS, and I stress the WIRES, despite what he thinks he knows, there are many wires required for the car to be started/ran.



You'll notice quite a few wires are the same color.. but different spots.. Wanna take a stab in the dark and guess why that is??



What good does getting the ignition on do if you can't start the car? Why jack around with high current wires requiring multiple high power relays when you can use a single relay on a low current switch? (The starter wire feeds a relay, which feeds the starter solenoid).