Make payments with PayPal - it's fast, free and secure! registry | CVN on Facebook | tech | news | email login Make payments with PayPal - it's fast, free and secure!


Welcome to CVN - Your Panther platform headquarters!


Custom Search


Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
#2615076 - 10/20/12 10:25 PM Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair
a_d_a_m Offline

3 Orange Whips
Metroplectic

Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 29128
Loc: Cleveland, OH
I've never done a writeup on anything, but figured that maybe I would take a stab at chronicling the steps that went into getting my car running. I think I was short on pictures, unfortunately.

Not sure how to get one added to the BOK, or if you guys even think it'd be a good idea. But this is what I did and this is what got my '03 Marauder running after a failed valve seat.

Adam


-------------------------------------------------


If you have a Marauder and haven't done your cooling mod yet, shame on you! And shame on me for never doing it and leading to this writeup.

Marauders are notorious for not cooling the rear DS cylinder head well enough. This causes your #8 valve seat to fail, a nice ticking noise, and then eventually your rocker falls out and lands in the corner of the head. The engine will start running like crap, maybe trip a code, and you'll find after a leakdown test that you have zero compression on cylinder #8.

Congrats. Your cylinder head now looks like this inside:


So now you're asking yourself "can I do this myself?"

Well, I don't know. But here's a little bit of a writeup to guide you along the way, should you choose to do it.

DISCLAIMER: if you hurt yourself or someone else in the process, destroy your engine or blow your car up, whatever....it ain't my damn fault. Any time you put your car up in the air with a jack, USE JACKSTANDS. Work safe.

Now that that's out of the way, if you still wish to proceed, here we go!

Tools you will need:
jack
jackstands
1/4" ratchet
3/8" ratchet
1/2" ratchet
torque wrench
pulley puller
sockets (especially 8mm, 10mm, 13mm, 15mm, and 18mm - deep well and regular!!!)
extensions
pliers and ChannelLocks
an assortment of screwdrivers
something to catch antifreeze

Tools that will probably make this job way easier:
a couple of extra people
plastic bags to hold bolts, or see my cardboard bolt holder laugh
impact gun
paint stick or Sharpie
soft mallet
hacksaw
torch
M6 tap
fuel line disconnect tool
10mm GearWrench
shop vac
razor blade

Parts and stuff you will need:
RTV sealant
valve cover gasket set (I used the FelPro kit, number V50477R from Advance)
timing cover seal set (FelPro 45980 from Advance)
DOHC head changing kit (cheapest w/free shipping from AmericanMuscle)
O-rings for your coolant crossover tube (Ford part 391533-S100, sold in packs of three)
new crank bolt
enough coolant for a proper burp
enough oil for a proper change
an oil filter
anti-seize lubricant
WD-40 or similar

Parts you might want to consider:
rear cooling mod (see www.musclemerc.com for a good one)
timing chain tensioners and guides
upper/lower intake gaskets + throttle body gasket (sold as a package on RockAuto.com - part number IG4171B)

Procedure*
*Some of the steps can be done out of order, this is just the way I worked through the project...

Also, I had already replaced my passenger side valve cover gasket and grommets, so this procedure DOES NOT describe removal of that (you'll need to find your own way when it comes to installing grommets and gaskets.


1. Turn off rear air suspension. If you don't know how to do this, STOP NOW, YOU'RE ALREADY IN THE WEEDS.
2. Disconnect negative battery terminal.
3. Remove cooling reservoir. Get ready for a bath. Find yourself something to catch coolant!
4. Remove electric fan.
5. Remove water pump pulley (4 bolts).
6. Remove serpentine belt.
7. Remove belt tensioner (writeup)
8. Place engine at 10 degrees minus TDC.
9. Remove crank bolt (18mm) with impact gun.
10. Remove harmonic balancer with pulley puller.
11. Unbolt power steering pump reservoir and swing it out of the way so it doesn't leak.
12. Remove power steering pump bolts (10mm). Three can be removed with an extension and a 10mm socket. The last one (above the line, you'll see it), is a PITA. This is where I used the GearWrench. Still a pain but not as bad.
13. Loosen and remove the 13mm oil pan bolts (you're under the car for the PS pump anyway).
14. Disconnect your H-pipe from your driver's side exhaust manifold.
15. Remove the cowl and wiper assembly (series of bolts and screws, not rocket science).
16. Disconnect fuel line.
17. Disconnect the random electrical and vacuum connections going to your plenum/intake.
18. Disconnect EGR at plenum. You may leave it connected at the exhaust end, because you'll pull it out with the head.
19. Remove the throttle body housing. Swing the linkage out of the way (you don't need to disconnect it).
20. Remove the upper plenum and intake.
21. Remove alternator.
22. Remove coolant crossover tube. May require a couple smacks from a soft mallet.
23. Disconnect and remove coils from spark plugs.
24. Remove DS/PS valve cover bolts.
25. Remove oil dipstick tube bolt.
26. Remove timing cover bolts.
27. Completely remove driver's side valve cover.
28. Lift passenger side valve cover off of timing cover.
29. Remove timing cover.
30. Remove timing chain tensioners and arms.
31. Remove main timing chains (LEAVE THE ONES ON THE CAMS!).
32. Using a breaker bar, remove all 10 cylinder head bolts.
33. Pull dipstick out of its hole in the oil pan, but leave it threaded through exhaust manifold.
34. Find some helpers and a landing place for your cylinder head.
35. Lift the head off of the motor, dipstick and manifold attached! May work best if you have someone standing in the engine compartment!
36. Remove dipstick.
37. Remove exhaust manifold.
38. Tape off in your intake on the passenger side, or stuff clean rags/paper towels in there.
39. Spray all open areas down with some oil. I used WD-40. The car will be sitting for a while.

At this point, you've done what you can. Find a machine shop, negotiate a price, and send it off to have new valve seats and most likely a valve installed since you've likely bent one.

While you're waiting for your head to come back, you can clean your timing cover and valve covers, and install the gaskets that you bought. So let's pretend you've done that...moving on...

40. Reinstall exhaust manifold/EGR to head. Swing EGR tube into approximate correct location.
40. Clean lower intake to head surfaces carefully. I used a razorblade, then shop-vac'd all the mess up.
41. Ensure your block-to-head surface is clean. Consider cleaning gently with some carb cleaner and clean rags. Can also clean the pistons in this manner...CAREFULLY. I coated the cylinder walls with a small film of oil.
42. Place LH head gasket onto block, ensuring proper fitment.
43. Get your friends again.
44. With one person under the car to line up the exhaust flange/bolts, have two other people place the cylinder head squarely onto the engine. There are some, well Idunno what they're called, but things sticking up to help you align them.
WARNING: your #6 cylinder will likely be at or near deck height. You will need to use an 18mm socket on your head before it is installed to close your #6 valves which should be wide open at this time. Otherwise you'll have a collision of piston + valves before you even start the car.

45. Coat the threads of your head bolts in motor oil.
46. Torque to following specs: 30 ft-lbs, loosen all. Then 30 ft-lbs again, +90 degrees, +90 degrees. Admittedly I can't remember the sequence at this time, but basically, start in the center top, then immediately underneath. Then work diagonal back and forth, up and down across the head.
47. Reinstall timing chains.
Click to reveal..
This is how I did it.
47a. Line timing chain up like this:

47b. Using a paint marker or Sharpie, mark the opposing end links.
47c. While the paint dries, find your lower timing gear set (whatever the hell it's called). Place it on the crank, dot side facing out. The dot should be at 6 o'clock.
47d. Place the driver's side timing chain on the lower gear. Your marked link should go 'around' the dot as follows.

47e. Place the driver's side timing chain on the cam gear, ensuring that the marked link goes 'around' the dot as seen above.
47f. Repeat 47d and 47e for passenger side. It may be necessary to use an 18mm socket on a breaker bar to turn the cams on the passenger side to get them to line up. Do so carefully, but make sure they line up.
47g. DOUBLE CHECK YOUR WORK.
48. Place tensioner arms on their spindles. I chose to replace mine as the passenger side arm was down to bare metal.
49. Bleed down old timing tensioners to aid in reinstallation. See 6:14 in this video.
50. Reinstall tensioners, pull paperclips.
51. Reinstall old crank bolt with several washers, then turn the engine slowly with a 18mm socket/ratchet combination. Feel and listen for interference. If it works, then slide your crank trigger wheel onto the crank. If not, you screwed up and will need to try timing it again.
52. Put a dab of RTV in the areas marked in this diagram. Otherwise your engine will leak.
53. Reinstall timing cover and torque bolts down in the order shown here.
54. Reinstall valve covers, adding a dab of RTV where the head meets the timing cover on top.
55. Install dipstick. You may experience difficulty getting it to line up due to the extra/unnecessary tubing on the end. You can use a hack saw or tubing cutter to remove some tubing - I left 1/4" below the O-ring to ensure it would still seal. You may need a friend to gently hit the bracket with a hammer while you guide it underneath to help it into place.
56. OPTIONAL: Using an M6 tap, gently clean up the threads for the bolts that connect the lower intake to the heads. I snapped one IN the head. Bolt welded itself in place, and no amount of Easy-Outing it would get it free. Ended up drilling through it, retapping the bolt itself, and hoping for the best. NOT OPTIMAL!
ALSO OPTIONAL: If you're doing a rear cooling mod (A SMART DECISION), this would be an ideal time to install it.

57. Place lower intake gaskets, install intake.
58. Place plenum gasket, install plenum.
59. Re-attach throttle body linkage with fresh gasket between plenum and TB.
60. Install spark plugs in head (spec is 11 ft-lbs, I went 12. Don't use too much anti-seize.), add coils and connect everything up. Install coil cover.
61. Start realizing that all of your electrical and vacuum connectors are lining up with things that need to be plugged in. Plug them in.
62. Reinstall alternator on lower two bolts.
63. Install coolant crossover tube with new O-rings on the lower part. Installation may require some persuasion with a soft mallet. And you may need to install new O-ring (available at any parts store) on the cap for your crossover.
Click to reveal..
My crossover cap was seized on. Needed to use a MAP torch to heat the surrounding area and then remove the cap. If you must do this, ensure that you remove the old O-ring that you've melted, clean the area, and reinstall using anti-seize. It does not need to be very tight at all.

64. Install alternator bracket (this also holds your coolant crossover tube in place).
65. Reinstall power steering pump, inventing new swear words in the process.
66. Ensure your front 4 oil pan bolts are snugged up while you're under there.
67. Reinstall harmonic balancer, using some RTV on the keyway to prevent leaks.
68. Reinstall water pump bolts, torque to hand-tight.
69. Reinstall belt tensioner.
70. Reinstall serpentine belt.
71. Torque water pump bolts down.
72. Reinstall coolant reservoir and connect radiator hoses.
73. Reinstall PS pump reservoir.
74. Change oil and filter.
75. Fill coolant reservoir with coolant, burp the car as outlined here (this also involves starting your car for the first time - so listen for bad noises and check for leaks/smoke! Some smoke will be normal on startup but should dissipate while burping the car. Also, your lifters will make some hellacious racket on the first few starts, so be prepared for that).
76. Provided there are no leaks, reinstall wipers and cowl.
77. Turn on rear air suspension.
78. Have a beer!
_________________________

'91 LTD Country Squire (POTM Mar. '19, Dec. '22) | '03 Marauder (POTM Nov. '10, Jul. '20)
'18 Flex EB | '92 Shadow VT1100C
formerly: '02 MGM, '04 MGM, '04 MGM v2.0, '04 MM, '07 P71 (POTM Feb. '18), '04 CVLX (POTM Jun. '19), '03 SAP P71, 2010 P7B (POTM Feb. '21)

Top
Links
#2615081 - 10/20/12 10:30 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
ajdereicup Offline
13 inches of pure joy
Poobah

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 6265
Loc: Lombard Il
Nice writeup. Just wondering is it only on the dohc engines that had this problem?
_________________________
Proud member of the 86400 Crew
My new ride = Lacoste Observe CA in black and white. REAL leather. How bout dem apples?
Originally Posted By gplayer
Thats way too much typing. AJ gets a pass because he only gets to do it once a day.

Top
#2615090 - 10/20/12 10:40 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
Chevyguy Offline

Poobah

Registered: 01/05/04
Posts: 9450
Loc: Winchester Mass
never heard of dropped seats on a 2v
_________________________
2004 MarauderM79 155K miles Jmod!! Rockin Stock tune Daily, Muscle Merc tune for track 14.85 @95.63
2004 Crown Vic LX SOLD!!

New Daily 2016 Dodge Charger R/T Road and track, purchase with 16K now 23K after 3 months. 5.7 Hemi, 8 speed ZF trans 3.06 open rear 13.98 @ 99.2 mph 4740 lbs with driver!!

R.I.P Photobucket 10 years of hosting down the drain

Project car 74 Chevy Laguna type S-3, # match 400 SBC

Previous rides
93 P-71 2001 P-73, 94 TC Exec, 96 TC Signature, 04 LX

Top
#2615095 - 10/20/12 10:46 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
ajdereicup Offline
13 inches of pure joy
Poobah

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 6265
Loc: Lombard Il
Ok I thought that was the case. 1 way the sohcs are better:)
_________________________
Proud member of the 86400 Crew
My new ride = Lacoste Observe CA in black and white. REAL leather. How bout dem apples?
Originally Posted By gplayer
Thats way too much typing. AJ gets a pass because he only gets to do it once a day.

Top
#2615112 - 10/20/12 11:20 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
a_d_a_m Offline

3 Orange Whips
Metroplectic

Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 29128
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Yeah, it's just the DOHCs.
_________________________

'91 LTD Country Squire (POTM Mar. '19, Dec. '22) | '03 Marauder (POTM Nov. '10, Jul. '20)
'18 Flex EB | '92 Shadow VT1100C
formerly: '02 MGM, '04 MGM, '04 MGM v2.0, '04 MM, '07 P71 (POTM Feb. '18), '04 CVLX (POTM Jun. '19), '03 SAP P71, 2010 P7B (POTM Feb. '21)

Top
#2615114 - 10/20/12 11:28 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
LimitedStreet Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 02/03/10
Posts: 1622
Loc: Reading,MA
Very well put together real world writeup!

Originally Posted By: a_d_a_m



1. Turn off rear air suspension. If you don't know how to do this, STOP NOW, YOU'RE ALREADY IN THE WEEDS.


I LOL'd. Chilton's should have this next to the first step of most how-to's.
_________________________
2003 Crown Vic P71- LED Stuff, SW Long Tubes + Cat-back, 18" Fanblades.

Top
#2615119 - 10/20/12 11:46 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
a_d_a_m Offline

3 Orange Whips
Metroplectic

Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 29128
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Hey, you never know who might attempt it...
_________________________

'91 LTD Country Squire (POTM Mar. '19, Dec. '22) | '03 Marauder (POTM Nov. '10, Jul. '20)
'18 Flex EB | '92 Shadow VT1100C
formerly: '02 MGM, '04 MGM, '04 MGM v2.0, '04 MM, '07 P71 (POTM Feb. '18), '04 CVLX (POTM Jun. '19), '03 SAP P71, 2010 P7B (POTM Feb. '21)

Top
#2615124 - 10/21/12 12:02 AM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: Chevyguy]
Ezbok58a Offline
Banned
Posting Addict

Registered: 06/17/04
Posts: 24124
Loc: Who wants to know...
Originally Posted By: Chevyguy
never heard of dropped seats on a 2v


And tuliped valves...
_________________________
I try not to take things personally...
Everyone's a person, how else are they supposed to take it?
'The portal to hell is opened with the incantation of good intentions'

Top
#2615222 - 10/21/12 09:53 AM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
CNGInterceptor Offline

Mr. 427
Grand Poobah

Registered: 03/18/07
Posts: 12312
Loc: Rhode Island
Great write-up Adam!
_________________________
1964 Ford Galaxie 500 R-Code
1972 Ford Galaxie 500
2008 Ford CVPI

Top
#2615238 - 10/21/12 11:00 AM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
prodigalson Offline
Banned
Over the Hill

Registered: 05/25/09
Posts: 3167
Loc: Cleveland, OH USA
Originally Posted By: a_d_a_m
44... There are some, well Idunno what they're called, but things sticking up to help you align them.

Dowels wink

Originally Posted By: a_d_a_m
44...
WARNING:
your #6 cylinder will likely be at or near deck height. You will need to use an 18mm socket on your head before it is installed to close your #6 valves which should be wide open at this time. Otherwise you'll have a collision of piston + valves before you even start the car.

This might be out of order, or incomplete. #6 will be at or near TDC when #1 is at TDC, and when the crank index is pointing to the TDC hash mark. The crank should probably be turned to TDC before the timing cover comes off, as there is a pointer on the cover. I didn't see that mentioned in the previous steps. Otherwise #6 could be anywhere in the cylinder.

Other than that, very well done!
_________________________
Permanently banned.

Top
#2615250 - 10/21/12 11:27 AM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: ajdereicup]
BigMerc96 Offline

I know nothing
Posting Addict

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 19872
Loc: I can see Detroit from here!
Originally Posted By: ajdereicup
Nice writeup. Just wondering is it only on the dohc engines that had this problem?
Not only the 4v, the 2v has this issue too, just not to the same extreme. Unless you are going power adder or FI, it'll likely never be an issue on a 2v. Still not a bad idea to do it anyway tho. Its cheap insurance that you won't have an issue.
_________________________
-Steve

2006 Audi A6 ~132k miles, stock.
1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS HPP ~100k miles, slowly acquiring modifications.
1997 Town Car Cartier ~145k miles, Ported Plenum, Gutted Airbox, Contour E-fan Retrofit, Dual exhaust with Magnaflows, cats deleted, MSD Ignition, KYB Gas-A-Justs, P71 front bar, air ride reinstated, Projector retrofit, Caddy 4-note horn retrofit, Wood rim steering wheel retrofit, holistic weight reduction as the parts fall off..
1996 Mercury Grand Marquis GS 117,485mi. R.I.P. 7/14/12 frown

Top
#2615307 - 10/21/12 01:39 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: prodigalson]
a_d_a_m Offline

3 Orange Whips
Metroplectic

Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 29128
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Originally Posted By: prodigalson
Originally Posted By: a_d_a_m
44...
WARNING:
your #6 cylinder will likely be at or near deck height. You will need to use an 18mm socket on your head before it is installed to close your #6 valves which should be wide open at this time. Otherwise you'll have a collision of piston + valves before you even start the car.

This might be out of order, or incomplete. #6 will be at or near TDC when #1 is at TDC, and when the crank index is pointing to the TDC hash mark. The crank should probably be turned to TDC before the timing cover comes off, as there is a pointer on the cover. I didn't see that mentioned in the previous steps. Otherwise #6 could be anywhere in the cylinder.
I think you're right - this part needs more review maybe...and maybe needs to be earlier in the proceedings. Now that you mention it, I had the crank turned to the TDC mark on the timing cover very early on.

When I took the timing cover off, the keyway was around the 10:30 mark. I made sure, with the timing chains attached, that the timing mark on the crank was at 6 o'clock.


Thanks all.
_________________________

'91 LTD Country Squire (POTM Mar. '19, Dec. '22) | '03 Marauder (POTM Nov. '10, Jul. '20)
'18 Flex EB | '92 Shadow VT1100C
formerly: '02 MGM, '04 MGM, '04 MGM v2.0, '04 MM, '07 P71 (POTM Feb. '18), '04 CVLX (POTM Jun. '19), '03 SAP P71, 2010 P7B (POTM Feb. '21)

Top
#2615661 - 10/22/12 09:58 AM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
Mest30 Offline
Posting Addict

Registered: 12/27/04
Posts: 16711
Loc: Midlothian, IL
So where can this cooling mod be purchased from?
_________________________



2003 CVPI SAP



Top
#2615711 - 10/22/12 12:46 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
a_d_a_m Offline

3 Orange Whips
Metroplectic

Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 29128
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Originally Posted By: a_d_a_m
rear cooling mod (see www.musclemerc.com for a good one)
Specifically here. Don't drink the MM.net Kool-Aid, where people will tell you that unless you're boosted or making super huge power you don't need one. My car saw occasional strip time with cooldown time between runs (I hot-lapped it a handful of times). Mostly I cruised it leisurely with a few spirited onramp pulls. Nothing major. And I still cooked it. So I do not subscribe to that notion - it's $100 of cheap insurance.
_________________________

'91 LTD Country Squire (POTM Mar. '19, Dec. '22) | '03 Marauder (POTM Nov. '10, Jul. '20)
'18 Flex EB | '92 Shadow VT1100C
formerly: '02 MGM, '04 MGM, '04 MGM v2.0, '04 MM, '07 P71 (POTM Feb. '18), '04 CVLX (POTM Jun. '19), '03 SAP P71, 2010 P7B (POTM Feb. '21)

Top
#2867539 - 10/19/14 09:51 PM Re: Writeup: '03 Marauder valve seat repair [Re: a_d_a_m]
a_d_a_m Offline

3 Orange Whips
Metroplectic

Registered: 10/25/05
Posts: 29128
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Two-year update:

The repair is still good. While the car does not see daily use, I have put over 10k on it since then, including a week-long trip on the Hot Rod Power Tour, capped with a run to/from STAP.

mercury
_________________________

'91 LTD Country Squire (POTM Mar. '19, Dec. '22) | '03 Marauder (POTM Nov. '10, Jul. '20)
'18 Flex EB | '92 Shadow VT1100C
formerly: '02 MGM, '04 MGM, '04 MGM v2.0, '04 MM, '07 P71 (POTM Feb. '18), '04 CVLX (POTM Jun. '19), '03 SAP P71, 2010 P7B (POTM Feb. '21)

Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >

Who's Online
2 registered (GooneyBird, wibiwo), 56 Guests and 11 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Shout Box

Top Posters (30 Days)
Dmblanch 33
Old_Guy_Stu 32
RF_Overlord 32
speedfreak 28
Bellwestern80 27
LordAeneas 23
PrincePolaris 21
a_d_a_m 19
GM_Guy 16
Traffic22 16
Member Spotlight
Member Since: 04/14/05
Posts: 7871





Copyright 2000-2015 by Crownvic.net and Steve Spaulding. All Rights Reserved.
The photographs, graphics and data contained in this Web site are the properties of the contributors, or Crownvic.net and may not be used without expressed written consent.
Crownvic.net is not affiliated with the Ford motor company.

Happily consuming the fuel saved by Prius owners!