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#2239985 - 02/16/11 11:36 AM Odometer & Speedometer Quit
mpope Offline
Stranger

Registered: 10/05/10
Posts: 2
Loc: 116
I know there are other threads on this in this forum, I've searched, but can't find an answer yet.

My odometer and speedometer both quit working. When starting the car the needle moves a little, so I'm assuming it's getting power, and when I hookup my scantool it's properly reading the vehicle speed.

Any ideas on what possibly could be wrong here?

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#2239990 - 02/16/11 11:42 AM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: mpope]
Nomad8326 Offline
A suspicious mind is a healthy mind.
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Registered: 02/03/08
Posts: 5956
Loc: Ohio
*cough* year, model? *cough*
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#2240042 - 02/16/11 12:57 PM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: Nomad8326]
mpope Offline
Stranger

Registered: 10/05/10
Posts: 2
Loc: 116
2000 P71

Sorry, not sure how I missed stating that. frown

Also, correcting what I said earlier, the spedometer needle isn't moving at all when starting (I thought it was).

Followup: checked fuses 1 and 6, both are good.


Edited by mpope (02/16/11 01:15 PM)

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#2240152 - 02/16/11 04:00 PM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: mpope]
TheShadow Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 05/01/07
Posts: 1342
Loc: SoCal High Desert
Sounds like your problem is with the VSS signal not getting into the instrument cluster. Do you have cruise control, and if so, does it work?

The VSS signal goes to the PCM first, then to a firewall connector (on a 98, it's C102 on the firewall; on a 00 I believe it's the topmost connector on the firewall outboard of the PCM connector) that feeds to the cruise control servo and through the firewall to the cluster. If your cruise control works (if you have it), then the problem is not the firewall connector, but beyond that towards the cluster.

I'd suggest pulling the cluster and checking the signal at the connector there.

Here's a link for the cluster connectors' pinout, courtesy of dRock96Marquis:
http://www.supermotors.net/registry/media/517512

Also, did you search on the Body and Interior forum? There may be a thread there....


Edited by TheShadow (02/16/11 04:03 PM)
_________________________
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New to list: '96 MGM (Nice! @ 35x,xxx), '97 CV P71, '98 CV P71, '00 CV P71, 01 P71 (2 of 'em) '03 CV P71 (Nice so far) (All Ford Zinc Yellow w/Black decals & trim) And the list is growing...........
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#2240442 - 02/16/11 10:11 PM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: mpope]
dRock96Marquis Offline

Da Governator
Posting Addict

Registered: 02/21/05
Posts: 24336
Loc: Maryland
^x2

This diagram is for '01-'02, but '98-'00 is nearly identical;




If your volt meter works, the speedo head is getting switched power (provided the printed circuit trace on back of cluster is not damaged or the metal pins/clips that connect to the speedo head itself) - there is also a constant hot which is shared with the air suspension lamp B+ feed (check fuse 8, 30amp, underhood fuse box) even if not equipped with RAS
The speedo head does have it's signal own ground wire (though spliced in the with the rest further down the harness)

You can check this ground using these pinouts;
http://www.supermotors.net/registry/media/569771

(Pin 14 of c251 - measure resistance to ground (should be little to none))

As mentioned before, if the voltmeter works switched power is fine. Test the constant hot feed by checking for voltage (hot at all times) on the Light blue/pink wire (pin 12 of c251 (see pinout link above))

Visually inspect the connectors, make sure they are firmly seated and not corroded, and check for damage to the circuit traces on the back of the cluster.

But, I agree with Shadow - the problem is likely a break in the VSS circuit somewhere between the splice for the PCM and the cluster itself. Testing the cruise operation as outlined above will isolate the location of the wiring issue. If the cruise works, then the inline connector (C102 as pointed out above - LH rear corner of engine bay) *and* the splice itself that supplies the cluster, cruise, EVO/RAS (if equipped), and speed chime (if equipped/GCC cars) should be fine - issue is somewhere between this splice and the cluster itself.
Again, provided the cluster printed circuit trace is not damaged and looks fine, the easiest solution would be to just run a new wire (from cluster connector, and spliced into the VSS wire (Gy/BK) either at the cruise module wiring or near the C102 connector (personally, I think it would be easier to splice in @ cruise connector)) and cutting off/capping the existing one.


FYI - A couple of years ago I helped another member track down this same exact issue before, though his vehicle was an '01 (problem was break in VSS circuit between s247 splice and cluster connector)

Though, don't forget to check those ground and power feeds to speedo head/cluster first!
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#2240469 - 02/16/11 10:51 PM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: mpope]
Michigansquadcar Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 02/22/01
Posts: 4892
Loc: Southeast michigan

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#2241121 - 02/17/11 07:57 PM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: Michigansquadcar]
P_Weston Offline
Cynical Bastard
Poobah

Registered: 06/27/07
Posts: 5011
Loc: Reno, Nevada
Lol, this issue again. I drove for the longest time and wasted hours upon hours at the Jones West Ford dealership and no one could figure it out. Then that part of the wiring that supplies the air suspension light... I spliced that to the + wire for my speedometer and tada, the speedometer/odometer worked. I still have no idea why it suddenly stopped working on me, but all I know is that it works now. My odo is off by about 1,500 miles now but whatever.

Not saying this is your fix, but I ripped so many hairs out and your problem was exactly the same as mine.
_________________________

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#2241412 - 02/18/11 08:58 AM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: P_Weston]
Michigansquadcar Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 02/22/01
Posts: 4892
Loc: Southeast michigan
Originally Posted By: P_Weston
Lol, this issue again. I drove for the longest time and wasted hours upon hours at the Jones West Ford dealership and no one could figure it out. Then that part of the wiring that supplies the air suspension light... I spliced that to the + wire for my speedometer and tada, the speedometer/odometer worked. I still have no idea why it suddenly stopped working on me, but all I know is that it works now. My odo is off by about 1,500 miles now but whatever.

Not saying this is your fix, but I ripped so many hairs out and your problem was exactly the same as mine.


Yup, for some reason the power wire to the odometer/speedo head looses switched ignition power. The wire color is Lt. Blue/Pink wire, hook up switched ignition power to it and you should be good to go.

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#2311914 - 06/09/11 05:55 PM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: mpope]
99_03PantherS Offline
Poobah

Registered: 03/22/03
Posts: 9439
Loc: NW side Chicago
Does anyone have pics of the wire that you spliced for power? i have the same problem
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#2312106 - 06/10/11 12:25 AM Re: Odometer & Speedometer Quit [Re: 99_03PantherS]
P_Weston Offline
Cynical Bastard
Poobah

Registered: 06/27/07
Posts: 5011
Loc: Reno, Nevada



The 6th pin from the right in this pic. It's a grayish wire that if you trace the positive feed for the air suspension light on the back of the dash cluster circuit grid (near the top center right) should be the target. Test with a meter when the car is switched for ignition. For the record, I don't remember if 03-05 is exactly the same. Just look for air suspension.
_________________________

PotM March 2014 & August 2012/2011 2000 Mercury Grand Marquis GS "Dewgong"

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