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#1804862 - 07/04/09 02:41 PM Re: Synthetic or Not Synthetic, that is the question. [Re: Chevyguy]
White Falcon LS Offline


Posting Addict

Registered: 01/01/02
Posts: 19113
Loc: SoCal
To be honest, OCI is also depends on you as the "operator". If you idle a lot, for instance, that would reduce your OCI. Fuel dilution isn't exactly a good thing for the oil or the engine.

Personally, I've run Group II HDEO oils for 10,000 km (6,250 mile) OCIs. The minimum I would consider running a Group III synthetic is 15/16,000 km (10,000 miles). OTOH, I'm running Mobil 1 0W-40 for 20,000 km (12,500 miles).

Having said that, it also depends on the oil itself...VI, TBN and maybe HTHS. Motorcraft Synthetic Blend, for instance, has a virgin TBN of 6.5. HDEOs (or dual-rated oils) generally have a TBN of 10 or higher...bear in mind TBN is reduced quite a bit once the oil is put into service. UOA is a good investment.

I'm personally more interested in ACEA certification, rather than the API, when choosing an oil. MB Sheet 229.3/5/5.1 or BMW LL-01/04 certification also a decent benchmark.

Having said that, when helping out friends or relatives with their Panther's oil changes, my choice is Fuchs Titan GT1 5W-30 for 15,000 km. It has no API or ILSAC certification, but is ACEA A3/B4 and C3, MB 229.31, BMW LL-04 approved - and these engines love it. For those willing to spend the extra, it's Mobil 1 0W-40 (which quickly shears down to a 30 weight).
_________________________
Lucifer: '01 Grand Marquis GS Convenience
Tuned By Marty @ Mo's Speed Shop

In Memory of Ned Nuss, Rick Richardson and Matt (2vmodular)

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#1804970 - 07/04/09 08:35 PM Re: Synthetic or Not Synthetic, that is the question. [Re: White Falcon LS]
RockBiter Offline
Member

Registered: 02/22/09
Posts: 176
Loc: St. Louis MO
Roy L Fuchs?
_________________________
2006 Crown Vic P71 116,800 miles. Ownership: West Virginia,Dealer,Me
3.55 Trac Lock. K&N Filter in stock air box
SOLD 1997 Crown Vic P71 175,000 miles
"Does this washcloth smell like chloroform to you?"
"I replaced my liver with a K&N filter, that way I get better flow."


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#1805081 - 07/05/09 12:38 AM Re: Synthetic or Not Synthetic, that is the question. [Re: BlueFusion]
Timmn1 Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 09/21/07
Posts: 1919
Loc: Near I-80 & I-57
I buy the Motorcraft Oil, simply because I can get it for 5 cents more a quart than the store brand.
_________________________
1997 Grand Marquis GS - Died
Now have a 2003 Grand Marquis LS

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#1805106 - 07/05/09 01:25 AM Re: Synthetic or Not Synthetic, that is the question. [Re: Cavenerd]
Squeek Offline
Climber

Registered: 10/28/03
Posts: 525
Loc: Behind you
 Originally Posted By: Cavenerd
When you purchase a used car, is there a test to determinine whether it's currently using Synthetic Oil or not?

If you really wanted to know, you could take a sample of the oil and submit it to a chromatography lab. This is probably more hassle and certainly more cost than it's worth.

 Originally Posted By: Ciffer
used to be hard to beat when it was Group V base oil, last i checked it was Group III.

Pennzoil Platinum has had a Group III basestock since day one. Group V basestocks are not typical in automotive use.

 Originally Posted By: BeforeIForget761
I've always used the Motorcraft Semi-Synthetic oil and Motorcraft oil filters for all of my Ford vehicles. If you took it to the dealer.. they'd be using the same stuff. Why not use stuff that Ford designed for the vehicles they build??

ConocoPhillips designed the oil, and Purolator designed the FL-820s. I say why buy synthetic blend when it's only between 20-35% synthetic, and a Group III to boot?

 Originally Posted By: White Falcon LS
Speaking of which, the FL-820S is the best filter you can use for this application!

Mortal Kombat is a very GOOD game; however, I think Donkey Kong is the best video game ever.

AMSOIL EaO11 - higher efficiency, capacity, and flow rate; rated for 25,000 miles or a year (small print: when used in conjunction with AMSOIL synthetic motor oils.)

 Originally Posted By: Crown Nick
25k intervals???

Yes.

 Quote:
I don't care how good the oil is, that just wouldn't sit well with me.

Chew on this: The last commercial jetliner you flew on hadn't had an oil change since coming out of the factory. Just the occasional top-up. [Source: History Channel - Modern Marvels: Lube Job]

 Originally Posted By: Chevyguy
Sure "true" group IV is better oil, and the Stories of Amsoil 20K changes are interesting. Not sure I could stomach that even with used oil analysis. You still have to change the filter a few times and do a lube service and inspection so that takes 80% of the time of the oil change so you would[n't?] save much time by the extended drain interval. I would worry about fuel buildup over time, your last drain interval was good but no guarantee that you will not build up fuel etc over the next 20 K miles.

As I stated above, the AMSOIL EaO11 is good for 25,000 miles or one year, whichever comes first. Numerous UOAs support that this line of filters effectively removes contaminants during extended drain intervals.

I treat the ball joints and pitman arm every 6 months or so with AMSOIL GHD Heavy-Duty moly grease, and after less than a pump or two there is already grease coming out of the boot. That means the stuff stays put, even after the temperature climbs above 80F.

And as for fuel dilution being a worry, every time I've done a UOA to comfort a customer who is using AMSOIL with extended drain intervals, the reports have shown the exact same number in the "Fuel Dilution" category -- <1%.

I save plenty of time with extended drain intervals. Inspection takes 10-15 minutes. OTOH if you don't have the discipline to do an occasional inspection, extended drains may not be for you.
_________________________
'93 P71 | Diseased 281 | 4R70W | Rusty as a cow's ass | AMSOIL EaA49 Air Filter | AMSOIL Lubes

Recently retired: AMSOIL TS49 Air Filter (goodbye oiled filters!)

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#1805182 - 07/05/09 07:58 AM Re: Synthetic or Not Synthetic, that is the question. [Re: Squeek]
White Falcon LS Offline


Posting Addict

Registered: 01/01/02
Posts: 19113
Loc: SoCal
 Originally Posted By: Squeek
Pennzoil Platinum has had a Group III basestock since day one. Group V basestocks are not typical in automotive use.


Some Platinum viscosities, such as 5W-20 and 5W-40, have some POA in it. Your Platinum is basically Shell Helix Ultra. Mobil 1 also uses some Group V in their products, mixed in with Group III/IV.

 Originally Posted By: Squeek
Mortal Kombat is a very GOOD game; however, I think Donkey Kong is the best video game ever.

AMSOIL EaO11 - higher efficiency, capacity, and flow rate; rated for 25,000 miles or a year (small print: when used in conjunction with AMSOIL synthetic motor oils.)


Amsoil EA filters are not exactly off the shelf filters, which is what I was referring to. And the catch is, it has to be used with Amsoil oils to last 25,000 miles....which you already pointed out.
_________________________
Lucifer: '01 Grand Marquis GS Convenience
Tuned By Marty @ Mo's Speed Shop

In Memory of Ned Nuss, Rick Richardson and Matt (2vmodular)

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#1805183 - 07/05/09 08:05 AM Re: Synthetic or Not Synthetic, that is the question. [Re: RockBiter]
White Falcon LS Offline


Posting Addict

Registered: 01/01/02
Posts: 19113
Loc: SoCal
 Originally Posted By: RockBiter
Roy L Fuchs?


German oil company, supplying factory fill lubricants to Mercedes-Benz. \:\)
_________________________
Lucifer: '01 Grand Marquis GS Convenience
Tuned By Marty @ Mo's Speed Shop

In Memory of Ned Nuss, Rick Richardson and Matt (2vmodular)

Top
#1805837 - 07/06/09 04:44 AM Re: Synthetic or Not Synthetic, that is the question. [Re: White Falcon LS]
RockBiter Offline
Member

Registered: 02/22/09
Posts: 176
Loc: St. Louis MO
 Originally Posted By: White Falcon LS
 Originally Posted By: RockBiter
Roy L Fuchs?


German oil company, supplying factory fill lubricants to Mercedes-Benz. \:\)

Sorry, I had to throw the "Used Cars" movie reference in there.
_________________________
2006 Crown Vic P71 116,800 miles. Ownership: West Virginia,Dealer,Me
3.55 Trac Lock. K&N Filter in stock air box
SOLD 1997 Crown Vic P71 175,000 miles
"Does this washcloth smell like chloroform to you?"
"I replaced my liver with a K&N filter, that way I get better flow."


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#1805906 - 07/06/09 09:21 AM Re: Synthetic or Not Synthetic, that is the question. [Re: RockBiter]
Jai Offline
Member

Registered: 04/20/09
Posts: 198
Loc: Texas
I did use Mobil 1 for a long time, then tried Royal Purple when it first came out on the market. I've also used Redline ( very expensive ) and many other synthetics. Every car/truck is going to react different, its just mostly preference. You can take a sample and have it sent in, but unless you disassemble the engine after x amount of miles with one brand, then do it again with another brand, you'll never see what the inside looks like and see the wear patterns. I use Asmoil myself for my 06 CV, simply b/c I feel comfortable with it, not b/c of the " extended interval times ". I still change my oil on a regular basis, plus Amsoil is one of the few right now that carries a fully synthetic 5w20. I use amsoil in all my vehicles, in the engine, trans and diff. Whatever feels comfortable and gives you piece of mind is what you need to go with. Jaguar has been claiming 10k services for quite some time now, they dont use fully synthetic oil, and there are people who wait 10k miles to change the oil. Then there are those who choose to be smart, and keep it changed on even more regular basis. If you're using Mobil 1, or Valvoline, or even Castrol, I seriously dont think you're going to have engine failure b/c of the oil you chose to use, as long as you keep it changed. Point being, pick one that suits your driving habits, keep it changed on a regular basis, and be done.


Edited by Jai (07/06/09 09:23 AM)

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