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#2241548 - 02/18/11 02:16 PM Cranks strong but won't start
OPS03 Offline
n00b

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 25
Loc: California
My 01 CVPI with 100K started fine yesterday, I turned it around in the driveway the incline is not too steep - front of the car higher. Today it won't start. No codes. Cranks strong with new battery. I do not hear any fuel pump - not sure what to listen for. It has half a tank of gas. The red button-type object in the trunk is still depressed. I cleaned the MAF recently, new plugs, a new coil. Plenty of clean, new oil. The catalytic converter is dead or dying I believe.

Any ideas would be appreciated.
Thanks,
Marc

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#2241556 - 02/18/11 02:25 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
BigMerc96 Offline

I know nothing
Posting Addict

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 19868
Loc: I can see Detroit from here!
Check all the fuses and swap the fuel pump relay w/ another one. there are a few things in these cars you could "borrow" a relay from, I think the a/c uses the same type of relay, can't remember. When you turn the key to run, You should hear the fuel pump whine for a few seconds then stop. also, when you turn the key to "run" the check engine light should come on. If the check engine light won't come on, then the ECU isn't getting power. If you can't hear the fuel pump, then its not getting power or has failed. If the ECU isn't on, obviously it won't be able to prime the fuel pump.
_________________________
-Steve

2006 Audi A6 ~132k miles, stock.
1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS HPP ~100k miles, slowly acquiring modifications.
1997 Town Car Cartier ~145k miles, Ported Plenum, Gutted Airbox, Contour E-fan Retrofit, Dual exhaust with Magnaflows, cats deleted, MSD Ignition, KYB Gas-A-Justs, P71 front bar, air ride reinstated, Projector retrofit, Caddy 4-note horn retrofit, Wood rim steering wheel retrofit, holistic weight reduction as the parts fall off..
1996 Mercury Grand Marquis GS 117,485mi. R.I.P. 7/14/12 frown

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#2241607 - 02/18/11 03:03 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
OPS03 Offline
n00b

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 25
Loc: California
I swapped the fuel pump relay with 'Relay #1' from under the power distribution fuse box near the battery. I heard the hissing after that.
My car started right up. When I don't have three screaming kids around me I'll swap the relays back to try to verify it was the fuel pump relay.

Many thanks,
Marc

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#2241858 - 02/18/11 09:12 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
BigMerc96 Offline

I know nothing
Posting Addict

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 19868
Loc: I can see Detroit from here!
Glad it was something simple, its always a good thing.
_________________________
-Steve

2006 Audi A6 ~132k miles, stock.
1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS HPP ~100k miles, slowly acquiring modifications.
1997 Town Car Cartier ~145k miles, Ported Plenum, Gutted Airbox, Contour E-fan Retrofit, Dual exhaust with Magnaflows, cats deleted, MSD Ignition, KYB Gas-A-Justs, P71 front bar, air ride reinstated, Projector retrofit, Caddy 4-note horn retrofit, Wood rim steering wheel retrofit, holistic weight reduction as the parts fall off..
1996 Mercury Grand Marquis GS 117,485mi. R.I.P. 7/14/12 frown

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#2242511 - 02/19/11 10:37 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
Raybo Offline
Member

Registered: 04/18/09
Posts: 483
Loc: Clearwater, Florida
Sorry dude but mine was the same way and it ended up as the fuel pump. Its very very common on these cars. So common the dealer may be out of stock for the pump and you'll have to go autozone.

I suggest you rent for free a fuel pressure gauge from Autozone and hook it to the shrader valve on the intake
and check the fuel pressure. It will tell you its not happy.
You have to force the pump on using the dongle on the drivers side wheel well.

The pisser is it may not even be the pump itself but the pump filter sock gets so nasty & clogged after a few years it starves the pump. Sock is unavailable. You'll see what I mean when you pull it.
_________________________
Sig removed. Read the rules.

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#2242711 - 02/20/11 11:51 AM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
BigMerc96 Offline

I know nothing
Posting Addict

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 19868
Loc: I can see Detroit from here!
Let not get ahead of ourselves here, Change the fuel filter if it hasn't been done recently. The service interval on these filters is only 15,000 mi, and driving w/ it clogged for an extended period of time will kill the pump. If the car seems fine after that, I wouldn't think too much into it. If the car still acts funny, then I would get a pressure tester and look farther into it. Relays do go bad, and its a simple fix, thats why it was in my first line of suggestions.
_________________________
-Steve

2006 Audi A6 ~132k miles, stock.
1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS HPP ~100k miles, slowly acquiring modifications.
1997 Town Car Cartier ~145k miles, Ported Plenum, Gutted Airbox, Contour E-fan Retrofit, Dual exhaust with Magnaflows, cats deleted, MSD Ignition, KYB Gas-A-Justs, P71 front bar, air ride reinstated, Projector retrofit, Caddy 4-note horn retrofit, Wood rim steering wheel retrofit, holistic weight reduction as the parts fall off..
1996 Mercury Grand Marquis GS 117,485mi. R.I.P. 7/14/12 frown

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#2257104 - 03/12/11 12:12 AM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
OPS03 Offline
n00b

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 25
Loc: California
Ok here's the update. I replaced the catalytic converter and have driven about 150 miles with node codes, BUT today at the drop-off/pick-up of my kids elementary school it would not start! Almost the same symptom as before it would crank hard except this time it would kick over but the gas peddle did nothing and it acted like it ran out of gas (half a tank) and just die. I hoped maybe vapor lock so I removed the cap, cranked, no start, replace the cap, cranked, start! I drove home (about 30 miles...don't ask) and after I parked and tried to re-start, no go. I ordered the motorcraft filter from Amazon should be here early next week but I'm thinking maybe Raybo is right.

When the car is running at a speed where I don't have much pressure on the pedal she seems to hesitate.

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#2257342 - 03/12/11 01:28 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
BigMerc96 Offline

I know nothing
Posting Addict

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 19868
Loc: I can see Detroit from here!
Next time it does this, Triple prime the fuel system before trying to crank it over. This is accomplished by turning the key to run for 5-10sec then turning it off, wait 30sec then turn it to run again. After the third time you turn it to run, try and start it. If it fires right up, then there is fuel pressure issues, either a clogged filter or a dying pump.
_________________________
-Steve

2006 Audi A6 ~132k miles, stock.
1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS HPP ~100k miles, slowly acquiring modifications.
1997 Town Car Cartier ~145k miles, Ported Plenum, Gutted Airbox, Contour E-fan Retrofit, Dual exhaust with Magnaflows, cats deleted, MSD Ignition, KYB Gas-A-Justs, P71 front bar, air ride reinstated, Projector retrofit, Caddy 4-note horn retrofit, Wood rim steering wheel retrofit, holistic weight reduction as the parts fall off..
1996 Mercury Grand Marquis GS 117,485mi. R.I.P. 7/14/12 frown

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#2257347 - 03/12/11 01:58 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
QuicksterP71 Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 02/05/11
Posts: 2114
Loc: Ma.
now it might be a good time to check the fuel pressure
_________________________

1997 Crown Vic P71 95.000 miles Formerly Mass Correctional Vehicle, Buying a new Vic one part at a time. Ported and polished plenum, 70mm throttle body, Remote starter, Body Work and New Paint Job, 35% window tint, HPP Wheels off a 96, Pioneer deh-1100mp, Pioneer TS-A6882R 6*8, Pioneer Premier TS-A933P 6*9

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#2257551 - 03/12/11 07:44 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
OPS03 Offline
n00b

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 25
Loc: California
Yes, I'm going to go to autozone and rent their pressure gauge. Is this what I need, so it's about $25 plus a bunch of my time.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Electric-...#ht_17758wt_935

and this one is $30 and comes with a new filter...which I already ordered but I'll need to change it again eventually.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Electric-...es#ht_500wt_956


Edited by OPS03 (03/12/11 07:53 PM)

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#2261640 - 03/18/11 07:26 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
OPS03 Offline
n00b

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 25
Loc: California
I replaced the fuel filter today. I had problems starting again before filter replacement. BTW Merc, I tried the tripled priming but there was no effect. I didn't hear the pump running then anyway.

After filter replacement I started it about 10x over the course of 30 minutes or so...no problem yet. I'm keeping my fingers crossed and I renewed my AAA membership!

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#2263173 - 03/21/11 12:34 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: Raybo]
OPS03 Offline
n00b

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 25
Loc: California
Is this the fuel strainer you're talking about?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=270693474637&viewitem=&sspagename=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT#vi-ilComp

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#2263284 - 03/21/11 03:37 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
Skoles Offline
Member

Registered: 12/17/08
Posts: 209
Loc: Mass
The people I bought the car from were having the same problem. Here's where I am with it so far:

https://www.crownvic.net/ubbthreads/ubbth...474#Post2259474
_________________________
2001 CVPI

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#2264876 - 03/23/11 10:27 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
OPS03 Offline
n00b

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 25
Loc: California
Ok here's the update:

No starting issues (for me) since the fuel filter install. The service guys claimed it would NOT start, then the next morning it did. I have driven all day today stopped and started probably a dozen times with no problem.

I bought a cheap fuel pressure guage from Harbor Freight ($20) and the pressure at the rail was about 9 after priming and about 32 when I turned the car on. Fuel was coming out of the back of the gauge so I think that probably reduces the reading compared to actual pressure. I'll probably return the gauge I don't think they're supposed to leak like that, right? I kept an extinguisher right-there, jic.

No codes but I feel hesitation the service guy said that was because I used the Bosch platinum plugs, I went to autozone and got Motorcraft for $3.50/ea (not bad) and I'll install them as soon as I can, probably Sunday.

I ordered a fuel pump filter there's a youtube video where a guy who seems to know what he's doing shows step-by-step where and what to do to get at it without dropping the tank. If you want the link to the video let me know.

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#2266067 - 03/25/11 08:25 PM Re: Cranks strong but won't start [Re: OPS03]
OPS03 Offline
n00b

Registered: 09/01/10
Posts: 25
Loc: California
The good news: The motorcraft plugs definitely helped with the hesitation issue. I did all 8 in 40 minuttes, 5 min per plug...not bad I think.

The bad news: After I installed the plugs I started and revved the engine and I heard a metallic clanking situation going on under the car on the driver side. It sounded different than the noise the cat made on the passenger side so I suppose my best hope is the muffler is going bad...cheaper than the cat.

More bad news: The car didn't start once today. The pump was not priming. I opened the gas cap and then closed it. I banged on the inertia switch until it tripped and then reset it. I turned the key and it started.


Edited by OPS03 (03/25/11 08:27 PM)

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