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#2350069 - 08/10/11 12:38 AM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: gDMJoe]
m_j Offline
Member

Registered: 11/06/07
Posts: 216
Loc: BC Canada
I am not going to waste too much time with someone that plays 'multi quotes out of context' style of trolling, but here is some food for your trolling pleasure

Originally Posted By: gDMJoe
And the year, make, and model of your vehicle is ?


plug info was not mentioned at all so do not even try and pretend it was.
still my car info has no relevance in the thread and you have yet to point out where it might have some.
if you have some useful info to share then I am all ears.
so far its all fluffy time wasting from you.

Originally Posted By: gDMJoe


Agree with Big_Bad_Joe ...[list][*]there's nothing wrong with Autolite spark plugs.
[*]spark plug blow-out is attributable to improperly installed spark plugs. *Ignoring cylinder head design.



you did type that didnt you?
so are we now on board with those autolights having a damaging effect on the threads? cause it seemed to me you were jumping on the 'Joe says there is nothing wrong with autolights' bandwagon
(and this would be the afore mentioned 'Joe the accountant' if you look at his profile under 'occupation', try and keep up.)

seems to me that when I have 8 plugs total ( 1 damaged due to ejecting from the head, 3 that have visible witness marks from thread contact where there shouldnt be any, and 4 that appear 'OK') and 4 of them are appear to be harmful to the threads that I wouldnt classify them as 'nothing wrong' but more along the lines of 'faulty manufacture'
if a 50% bad product delivery to the consumer is 'nothing wrong with' by your standards then I am afraid we simply have an irreconcileable difference.
_________________________
2004 p71 ex RCMP- it is a beater
tr3650 from 2005 mustang
hydraulic clutch (using ford truck master, mustang slave) fabbed pedal assembly
tuned using Delta Force by http://www.dirtydirtyracing.com/ through email smile great customer service
aeromotive 11142 fuel pump

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#2350156 - 08/10/11 03:45 AM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
TheShadow Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 05/01/07
Posts: 1556
Loc: SoCal High Desert
For everyone's info, here is a tidbit of info, and also a good website for reference. Below are exerpts from the link regarding spark plug threading:

http://www.enginebuildermag.com/Article/2238/rebuilding_the_ford_46l_sohc_engine.aspx

1991–1992 Romeo
The Romeo engine used the F1AE casting in 1991 and part of ’92. It appears that the heads were changed at the same time the block was changed, so this head was probably used through 11/1/91 on the Lincoln Town Cars and through 2/18/92 on the rest of the Ford and Mercury cars.

It has two "ladder style" cam caps, nine bolt holes for the rocker cover and it’s threaded for long reach spark plugs most of the time. However, there are some F1AE castings that are threaded for the later short reach plugs, so be sure to check the threads before using this casting.

1992-1995 Romeo (1992-’94 all, 1995 T-Bird/Cougar)
The F2AE/F4AE head replaced the original Romeo head in mid-1992, but there are some F1AE castings that are threaded for the short reach plugs, so they can be used for these applications, too. There were two changes: 1) these castings had fewer threads for the spark plugs; and 2) the pad on the front of the head for the chain tensioner was 1.0 mm/.040&#733; shorter than it was on the earlier heads.


So, some of the 4.6s did indeed have more threading, and are related to the Aero/Whale forum.

m_j, those pictures of the plugs reminded me of a recent poster who had gotten one Autolite out of the box with the ground electrode welded on sideways! I cannot find the post with pictures now, but it was unbelievable how screwed-up it was, and totally unusable. Again, it was a relatively recent post (probably less than 6 months), so quite possibly there may be some 'new' manufacturing problems with Autolite.

I always gap plugs before installing, and do a cursory visual inspection. Thankfully I haven't yet come across a plug such as you did...yet...
_________________________
'95 P71, 5xx,xxx miles, Rebuilt tranny, 2.73. Lives as a cab, and will die as a cab. (Died-FrontEnder)
'96 P71, 640,xxx on original drivetrain. (Now parts car - T-bone & roll)(You should see the roof - A,B & C-pillars chopped on driver side)
New to list: '96 MGM (Nice! @ 35x,xxx), '97 CV P71, '98 CV P71, '00 CV P71, 01 P71 (2 of 'em) '03 CV P71 (Nice so far) (All Ford Zinc Yellow w/Black decals & trim) And the list is growing...........
Taxicab mechanic: I HATE DRIVERS!

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#2350315 - 08/10/11 11:10 AM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
gDMJoe Offline


Poobah

Registered: 06/03/03
Posts: 7657
Loc: Timbuk3, MI
Quote:
m_j ...
Originally Posted By: gDMJoe
And the year, make, and model of your vehicle is ?

plug info was not mentioned at all so do not even try and pretend it was.[/i]

-Correct- Hovever, as noted SEVERAL TIMES now ...
Quote:
still my car info has no relevance in the thread and you have yet to point out where it might have some.

The vehicle info' would influence the spark plug selection / info'. *Which would/could present the possibility that the incorrect plug was used.

Shouldn't have to play 20 questions to get info'.

Quote:
Originally Posted By: gDMJoe
Agree with Big_Bad_Joe ...
  • there's nothing wrong with Autolite spark plugs.
  • spark plug blow-out is attributable to improperly installed spark plugs. *Ignoring cylinder head design.

you did type that didnt you?

-Yes-

Quote:
so are we now on board with those autolights having a damaging effect on the threads? cause it seemed to me you were jumping on the 'Joe says there is nothing wrong with autolights' bandwagon

-Correct- There is nothing wrong with Autolite spark plugs (which is what I've said all along). However, Big_Bad_Joe and I diverge as to the need / merit of anti-seize. Which is NBD.

Quote:
seems to me that when I have 8 plugs total ( 1 damaged due to ejecting from the head, 3 that have visible witness marks from thread contact where there shouldnt be any, and 4 that appear 'OK') and 4 of them are appear to be harmful to the threads that I wouldnt classify them as 'nothing wrong' but more along the lines of 'faulty manufacture' if a 50% bad product delivery to the consumer is 'nothing wrong with' by your standards then I am afraid we simply have an irreconcileable difference.

Never indicated that there couldn't be the possibility of a bad batch ( happens to -ALL- suppliers ), however, having changed, or oversaw the changing of, several 10s of thousands of Autolite spark plugs, my experience has been 0 (zero) defects. *As long as you don't count broken porcelains due to shipment/delivery mis-handling.

AGAIN ... What moron installs spark plugs without inspecting them ?

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#2350414 - 08/10/11 02:29 PM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
abelouso Offline
Member

Registered: 01/06/07
Posts: 234
Loc: Inland Empire, CA, US
Fascinating arguments. Love it! Fancy syntax highlights too well worth the 38 years of IT experience. The point is missed. Thank you m_j for bringing this problem to our attention - from now on I, personally, will inspect each plug for the subject of a manufacturing defect possibly adversely affecting threads. Before, I always looked at the threads of the plug and checked the gap, but never inspected any other part of the plug. Now I know, thanks to m_j.
Another point I'd like to make - is if the manufacturing defect of the plug caused damage to the engine, should the manufacturer pay for repairs? Is it worth at least contacting Autolite's QA department and asking? Good faith type of path...

Thank you
_________________________
---
2003 Ford CVPI
Sasha

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#2350600 - 08/10/11 08:06 PM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: TheShadow]
m_j Offline
Member

Registered: 11/06/07
Posts: 216
Loc: BC Canada
the only way you are going to catch the bad weld would be to use a thread pitch gauge or as previous poster stated run them through a die on ones that look iffy.
visually you will see the lump but without a gauge you wont know if it is in the threads

these autolite plugs have seen a full service life and from a google search they are a discontinued P#, so I dont think we can blame it on new problems at autolight.

I took images to help reassembly but I doubt a casting number is in them as I was more concerned with wire routing and getting bolts back in the same spots as they came out of
_________________________
2004 p71 ex RCMP- it is a beater
tr3650 from 2005 mustang
hydraulic clutch (using ford truck master, mustang slave) fabbed pedal assembly
tuned using Delta Force by http://www.dirtydirtyracing.com/ through email smile great customer service
aeromotive 11142 fuel pump

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#2350606 - 08/10/11 08:30 PM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: abelouso]
m_j Offline
Member

Registered: 11/06/07
Posts: 216
Loc: BC Canada
you are welcome. thank you for the post.

on the blame Autolite part...
I am Canadian and we arent as litigious as our southern nieghbors so it never occured to me to contact autolite.
It would be nice to get the $450 timesert kit and $300+ in gaskets payed for by someone else
I figure they know they make junk and talking to one of their desk jockeys would be more pain then it is worth as I would probably have to listen to another fanboy claim they supervised plug installs from their desk thousands of times with zero defects.
also I was not the purchaser of the plugs, nor the installer, nor the owner of the vehicle at the time of install

the bosch cost around $9 each but they sure are pretty.
I was told the pretty is higher nickle content to resist corrosion in aluminum heads better then lesser plugs but I still nev-r-siezed them into my $12 each timeserts
_________________________
2004 p71 ex RCMP- it is a beater
tr3650 from 2005 mustang
hydraulic clutch (using ford truck master, mustang slave) fabbed pedal assembly
tuned using Delta Force by http://www.dirtydirtyracing.com/ through email smile great customer service
aeromotive 11142 fuel pump

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#2350623 - 08/10/11 09:04 PM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: gDMJoe]
m_j Offline
Member

Registered: 11/06/07
Posts: 216
Loc: BC Canada
Originally Posted By: gDMJoe

-Correct- Hovever, as noted SEVERAL TIMES now ...
Quote:
still my car info has no relevance in the thread and you have yet to point out where it might have some.

The vehicle info' would influence the spark plug selection / info'. *Which would/could present the possibility that the incorrect plug was used.

Shouldn't have to play 20 questions to get info'.


this thread is not about selection of spark plugs other then maybe to select something other then autolites as they are poorly made and will damage your heads.
if you want a thread about selecting spark plugs then go make one. I bought bosch.

you shouldnt have to play 20 quotes ever.

Originally Posted By: gDMJoe

-Correct- There is nothing wrong with Autolite spark plugs (which is what I've said all along).


great so Joe the accountant and Joe the IT guy both love autolite spark plugs.

well have I got a deal for you. I have a set of 7 'nothing wrong with' autolites I will sell you for a great deal, and I will even throw in an 8th slightly dinged up 'nothing wrong with' autolite as an added limited time offer. no warranty expressed or implied.
lets say $800 plus shipping, that should cover my parts to fix the 'nothing wrong with' damage


Quote:


Never indicated that there couldn't be the possibility of a bad batch ( happens to -ALL- suppliers ), however, having changed, or oversaw the changing of, several 10s of thousands of Autolite spark plugs, my experience has been 0 (zero) defects. *As long as you don't count broken porcelains due to shipment/delivery mis-handling.


interesting but I know a tech who says it isnt uncommon with autolites.
then there is the post by Shadow stating this very forum had a autolite fail QC thread recently.

Quote:

AGAIN ... What moron installs spark plugs without inspecting them ?



mechanics would likely be the morons you are refer to. they usually have some moron service writer pushing them to beat book time so they take shortcuts.
I would love to see a tech pull out a thread pitch guage or die set for a plug install in view of the leadhand or shop manager.

I am guessing you have never seen it due to not knowing what to look for, same as everyone else.
_________________________
2004 p71 ex RCMP- it is a beater
tr3650 from 2005 mustang
hydraulic clutch (using ford truck master, mustang slave) fabbed pedal assembly
tuned using Delta Force by http://www.dirtydirtyracing.com/ through email smile great customer service
aeromotive 11142 fuel pump

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#2350688 - 08/10/11 10:39 PM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
Bughole Offline
n00b

Registered: 03/09/09
Posts: 41
Loc: CA, USA
You asked for what reason I started running a die over the threads. Many moons ago when I was racing outboards, I found that plugs in aluminum heads caused me some unwanted problems, stripped threads, poor running engines. Buy a die, it is worth the time to use one.

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#2350994 - 08/11/11 11:09 AM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
gDMJoe Offline


Poobah

Registered: 06/03/03
Posts: 7657
Loc: Timbuk3, MI
Quote:
m_j ... on the blame Autolite part... I am Canadian and we arent as litigious as our southern nieghbors so it never occured to me to contact autolite.

Some FFT ... As an example -

...customs seized export fake "AUTOLITE" brand spark plug...

While Chinese forgery is a global issue, because the lower 48 is "litigious", the US tends to catch more than (say) CA.


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#2351000 - 08/11/11 11:22 AM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
gDMJoe Offline


Poobah

Registered: 06/03/03
Posts: 7657
Loc: Timbuk3, MI
Quote:
m_j ...mechanics would likely be the morons you are refer to. they usually have some moron service writer pushing them to beat book time so they take shortcuts. I would love to see a tech pull out a thread pitch guage or die set for a plug install in view of the leadhand or shop manager.

I've been fortunate enough to work in small repair facilities that usually included 2-4 tech's. And my method was to inspect each and every part before handing it over to the tech'. *No sense wasting valuable tech' time if the part is wrong and/or FUBARed. Didn't always catch everything, but broken spark plugs - Yes.

Quote:
I am guessing you have never seen it due to not knowing what to look for, same as everyone else.

And you would be "guessing" wrong. And I sure as hell didn't / won't use a Taiwanese thread guage.

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#2351045 - 08/11/11 12:55 PM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: gDMJoe]
Blackcvpi Offline
Cynical Jackass
Poobah

Registered: 05/19/09
Posts: 5427
Loc: Somewhere in the CRC
.
_________________________
2003 Crown Victoria ( AKA Car Craft Crown Vic ) ff, Trick Flow 38CC top end kit, 04 Navigator water pump, Circle D multi disk 3500-3700 stall converter, Full SW exhaust, MM Airbox and MAF, ADTR zip tube, 78mm BBK Plenum and TB, Transgo Stage 2 shift kit, 3.73 with track lok, Naake coilover suspension, Henious control arms, Metco watts link, ARP watts link stud, Addco sway bars, Powerslot rotors with Hawk HPS pads, BH1976 headlight relay harness, Procar sportsman pro race seat's, 17" steel rims widened to 9.0 with Nitto 555's in 285/40/17 tire for the rear, Tuned by Mo's Speed Shop in Dallas Georgia....more mods coming soon.

1997 Mercury Grand Marquis HPP. Full PI engine swap, Stock PI torque converter, 04 Navigator water pump, 3.27 with trac lok




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#2351088 - 08/11/11 01:54 PM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
Taximan Offline
Climber

Registered: 05/30/06
Posts: 788
Loc: Livonia, Michigan
^^^Believe he is referring to Canada.
_________________________
Too many cars, not enough time.

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#2351338 - 08/11/11 09:47 PM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
m_j Offline
Member

Registered: 11/06/07
Posts: 216
Loc: BC Canada
a quick google on autolite plugs turns up that they are made in china

Bughole. thanks for further info. experience is a best teacher
_________________________
2004 p71 ex RCMP- it is a beater
tr3650 from 2005 mustang
hydraulic clutch (using ford truck master, mustang slave) fabbed pedal assembly
tuned using Delta Force by http://www.dirtydirtyracing.com/ through email smile great customer service
aeromotive 11142 fuel pump

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#2351495 - 08/12/11 03:52 AM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
Gotts2BMe Offline
Member

Registered: 06/17/09
Posts: 246
Loc: Canada
I have had lots of problems with autolite plugs. Ford zetecs and modulars. All the same way. Runs great for 2000 miles or so then you start getting random miss fires across a couple cylinders then by about 3000 miles across all cylinders. Take out the genesys scanner and it goes crazy with all the misfires and 100% totally random. Toss out the autolites and stick in NGK's or motorcrafts, and the problem is solved.


Sorry Joe but I am now taking everything you post with a grain of salt. Almost all cracks in porcelain cannot be seen by the naked eye either.
_________________________
1995 Lincoln Town Car - 5.4 swap, no cats, true dual magnaflow, trac loc, 4 link, ported intake, SCT tuning

2000 F150 5.4 - Long Tube headers, Gotts intake, magnaflow exhaust, UDP's, efans, ported intake, 75mm TB, SCT tuning, 33" Firestone M/T's

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#2351576 - 08/12/11 09:35 AM Re: spark plug issues caused by autolite plugs [Re: m_j]
Rizzo Offline
J-MOD Master
Metroplectic

Registered: 03/06/04
Posts: 29215
Loc: Romulus,MI
Autolite plugs are made at the same Hammond (sp?) plant as the Motorcraft plugs.
_________________________


The Jmod video is done! LINK!

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