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#2809855 - 02/14/14 11:31 AM SHOCKS
2002crownvic Offline
n00b

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 47
Loc: Los Angeles
I know this topic gets touched on frequently here but I need to know if anyone has a 2002 CV LX and what kind of shocks are you using with the soft factory springs. I have KYB gas a just all around and the car still floats. I do not have the police shocks. In the rear I have the 5521 and 5572 in front. I don't know if the 5521 could be considered the police shocks but the car gets kind of low with passengers and luggage. When empty the car drives fine in the rear and the front bounces with or without weight. Any suggestions for KYB or Monroe shocks to keep the rear from sagging and the front from bouncing? Anyone using Moroes and how happy are you with them. I don't want to change the springs. I tried that and it wasn't pretty (too stiff). I want to keep the factory springs but firm up the car.


Edited by 2002crownvic (02/14/14 11:35 AM)

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#2809873 - 02/14/14 12:46 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: 2002crownvic]
Wags4000 Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 1694
Loc: Northumberland, PA
I have an 01 Merc which is the same suspension as your 02 CVLX. I've predominantly used Gabriel Ultras from autozone. the car does float a bit with cheaper shocks. as I'm sure you've seen in other threads on this topic, there isn't much middle ground between too soft and too stiff on these cars. they are always going to float a bit just due to the size and weight. never going to handle like a mustang.
for the sagging rear, consider adding a pair of airlift bags to the springs. keep them at low psi when the car is unloaded and then add some air to level it out when you have extra people and luggage.
for the front, one thing that will really tighten the car up is some new ball joints, control arm bushings, and tie rod components. how many miles are on the current components?
tire type and pressure also really affect the 'float'. at 32-35 psi (as recommended on the door sticker) the car feels way too soft. I run mine at 40-42 psi generally and the car handles much better. also a cheep off brand tire may be mushy.
a rear sway bar would also help.

look at it from a 'total car' view point rather than just trying to get the shocks to do it all.
_________________________
2003 CVLX; 312k mi (perch 103k); P74; Black Paint/Black leather; Blinking side marker mod; 2.73 open dif; Autolite Dbl Plat; General Altimax RT43; LCM Ext relay, FRPP mani; Max-Life 5w-30


03 Crown Victoria LX by Wags4000, on Flickr

2001 Merc GM LS; RIP at 340k mi (bought at 67k)-my former commuter. Finally passed on due to no one driving it and things just stopped working.

1986 Merc GM LS; 165k mi (bought at 118k)- Red with White vinyl half roof; 5.0L; RIP
87 Caprice Wagon; 356k; 5.0L(307cu) RIP

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#2809882 - 02/14/14 01:05 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: 2002crownvic]
torotoro Offline
Climber

Registered: 01/29/12
Posts: 692
Loc: NJ
I really like the Bilsteins. I don't find them too trucky as some complain and they definitely aren't floaty at all. I also run my tires (GY TripleTreads) at 40 psi.

http://www.eshocks.com/bil_veh.asp?Model_Index=3Q5&Manf=All&SubChar=Q
_________________________
2002 LX Spruce Green/Tan Cloth ~120000 miles
Bilsteins, 17mm rear sway bar, BH1976 headlight relay harness, side marker/blinker mod
BC4E Dead Pedal, Upgraded Speakers, 35% Window Tint, De-chromed Exterior, Soundproofing.


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#2809883 - 02/14/14 01:06 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: 2002crownvic]
BigMerc96 Offline

I know nothing
Posting Addict

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 19868
Loc: I can see Detroit from here!
^^what he said.

The softer front shocks are not helping you either. My buddy has a fresh set of whale GMQ spec'd front KYBs in his '97 Town Car, I have 50k mile whale CVPI spec KYBs in mine. All else being equal, and his has considerably more float than mine.

EDIT: I forgot his car no longer has the rear air suspension, he has coils from a '99 CVLX that were formerly in my car while I have the even softer rear air suspension. I still have less float. In my experience, most of the float feeling in these cars is in the front suspension unless the rear shocks are totally blown out.

As for the sagging under load, that is NOT the shocks. I hate that people seem to always think it is. In reality, the shocks have absolutely zero effect on ride height or load capacity. That is unless you have air shocks or coil overs, but that's NOT the case on a Panther. What you are experiencing is sagging springs. You need new springs. Either that or like suggested above, the air helper springs. Those would allow you to add air and level the car out in the event that you have it loaded down, while maintaining the normal ride.


Edited by BigMerc96 (02/14/14 01:11 PM)
Edit Reason: added some stuff.
_________________________
-Steve

2006 Audi A6 ~132k miles, stock.
1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS HPP ~100k miles, slowly acquiring modifications.
1997 Town Car Cartier ~145k miles, Ported Plenum, Gutted Airbox, Contour E-fan Retrofit, Dual exhaust with Magnaflows, cats deleted, MSD Ignition, KYB Gas-A-Justs, P71 front bar, air ride reinstated, Projector retrofit, Caddy 4-note horn retrofit, Wood rim steering wheel retrofit, holistic weight reduction as the parts fall off..
1996 Mercury Grand Marquis GS 117,485mi. R.I.P. 7/14/12 frown

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#2809890 - 02/14/14 01:41 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: Wags4000]
2002crownvic Offline
n00b

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 47
Loc: Los Angeles
Hey wags400 my car has 73000miles with kumho tires. Tire pressure is usually around 40 lbs. I don't think the suspension is ready for surgery just yet as the previous owner was an older lady and I myself have not abused the car. I just need to keep the car from bouncing too much in the front. What shocks do you have on your car.

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#2809893 - 02/14/14 02:05 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: BigMerc96]
2002crownvic Offline
n00b

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 47
Loc: Los Angeles
Hey big merc96 my car sits normal when not loaded and it doesn't seem to sag at all. What do you think of Monroe 50051 for the rear as it has a small coil around the shock and the shock is a gas shock. Also, how do you get your shocks specd to your car like your friend did?

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#2809895 - 02/14/14 02:10 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: torotoro]
2002crownvic Offline
n00b

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 47
Loc: Los Angeles
Torotoro I wish I could install the Bilsteins but they are too fat for my thin wallet. By the way, you and I have the same identical car. Does your car sag with passengers in the back? Would you happen to know the spring rate for our cars? My car doesn't have a rear sway bar. Where did you get yours?


Edited by 2002crownvic (02/14/14 02:14 PM)

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#2809897 - 02/14/14 02:25 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: 2002crownvic]
Wags4000 Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 1694
Loc: Northumberland, PA
Originally Posted By: 2002crownvic
Hey wags400 my car has 73000miles with kumho tires. Tire pressure is usually around 40 lbs. I don't think the suspension is ready for surgery just yet as the previous owner was an older lady and I myself have not abused the car. I just need to keep the car from bouncing too much in the front. What shocks do you have on your car.


I have Gabriel Ultra's from autozone on the 01 merc. my 03 DD has Monroe shocks from the previous owner.
12 year old car....the joints may not be completely gone, but you would see a difference with new ones.
_________________________
2003 CVLX; 312k mi (perch 103k); P74; Black Paint/Black leather; Blinking side marker mod; 2.73 open dif; Autolite Dbl Plat; General Altimax RT43; LCM Ext relay, FRPP mani; Max-Life 5w-30


03 Crown Victoria LX by Wags4000, on Flickr

2001 Merc GM LS; RIP at 340k mi (bought at 67k)-my former commuter. Finally passed on due to no one driving it and things just stopped working.

1986 Merc GM LS; 165k mi (bought at 118k)- Red with White vinyl half roof; 5.0L; RIP
87 Caprice Wagon; 356k; 5.0L(307cu) RIP

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#2809899 - 02/14/14 02:32 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: 2002crownvic]
BigMerc96 Offline

I know nothing
Posting Addict

Registered: 06/05/10
Posts: 19868
Loc: I can see Detroit from here!
Originally Posted By: 2002crownvic
Hey big merc96 my car sits normal when not loaded and it doesn't seem to sag at all. What do you think of Monroe 50051 for the rear as it has a small coil around the shock and the shock is a gas shock. Also, how do you get your shocks specd to your car like your friend did?
I've not used the Monroe coil overs. Not a fan of monroe anything.

As for "spec'd" shocks, all I mean is they are the ones intended for a different car. In the case of mine and my buddy's cars, they are intended for a newer model. The shocks listed for our Aero models are different in alot of brands, tho the KYBs aren't one of them. IIRC the Town Cars do actually have a different front shock listed, but rear shocks are the same as other models.
_________________________
-Steve

2006 Audi A6 ~132k miles, stock.
1998 Mercury Grand Marquis LS HPP ~100k miles, slowly acquiring modifications.
1997 Town Car Cartier ~145k miles, Ported Plenum, Gutted Airbox, Contour E-fan Retrofit, Dual exhaust with Magnaflows, cats deleted, MSD Ignition, KYB Gas-A-Justs, P71 front bar, air ride reinstated, Projector retrofit, Caddy 4-note horn retrofit, Wood rim steering wheel retrofit, holistic weight reduction as the parts fall off..
1996 Mercury Grand Marquis GS 117,485mi. R.I.P. 7/14/12 frown

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#2809900 - 02/14/14 02:45 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: 2002crownvic]
RF_Overlord Offline

Poobah

Registered: 12/14/02
Posts: 7470
Loc: MA
When I bought my DD back in July of '12, it was kinda bouncy, especially in the back. 120,000 on the original shocks, so no surprise there. New Gabriel Guardians all around and it's much better.

I know, people will say I'll be replacing them again next year, but I drive very little and it's generally only me in the car or maybe one other, so I think they'll do me for a while.
_________________________
'03 Mercury Marauder (The Blackbird)
Trilogy Motorsports supercharged #61
Too many mods to list / Driveway Queen

'04 Grand Marquis LS Limited Edition (Spruce Green)
Daily Driver (Thanks, Adam!)

'00 Grand Marquis GS (Silver)
Rotted frame and broken transmission crossmember
Being resurrected...slowly.

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#2809905 - 02/14/14 03:23 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: BigMerc96]
2002crownvic Offline
n00b

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 47
Loc: Los Angeles
Bigmerc96 I just remembered that several months ago I replaced the shocks on my wife's 2000 Montero sport with kyb's all around and the funny thing with that car is that it doesn't have any type of spring in the front only shocks holding up the weight and they are stiff for that car. They are the gr2 and not the gas a justs.I compressed the shocks before installing them and were pretty easy to compress. How is it possible for the shocks to hold l that weight up?

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#2809907 - 02/14/14 03:28 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: RF_Overlord]
Wags4000 Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 1694
Loc: Northumberland, PA
I was actually pretty happy with the Gabriel's on the 01, but I expect a certain amount of float out of this boat. they lasted well over 50k miles before I felt they needed replaced. they still had a fair amount of damping ability even at that mileage. they did not 'blow out' as I've seen some cheep shocks do.
I drive 110 miles round trip for work each day. its mostly highway, but in PA highways aren't all that smooth.

also, be very careful of coil-over (load helper/leveler) type rear shocks. many of them (in the past anyway) were oil filled, not gas filled shocks.
they do work pretty decent if you haul things often, but they can be pretty rough on an unloaded car. I had Gabriel coil-over rear shocks on my 87 caprice wagon and they worked very well. never used the Monroe ones though.
_________________________
2003 CVLX; 312k mi (perch 103k); P74; Black Paint/Black leather; Blinking side marker mod; 2.73 open dif; Autolite Dbl Plat; General Altimax RT43; LCM Ext relay, FRPP mani; Max-Life 5w-30


03 Crown Victoria LX by Wags4000, on Flickr

2001 Merc GM LS; RIP at 340k mi (bought at 67k)-my former commuter. Finally passed on due to no one driving it and things just stopped working.

1986 Merc GM LS; 165k mi (bought at 118k)- Red with White vinyl half roof; 5.0L; RIP
87 Caprice Wagon; 356k; 5.0L(307cu) RIP

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#2809908 - 02/14/14 03:29 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: 2002crownvic]
Wags4000 Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 03/13/13
Posts: 1694
Loc: Northumberland, PA
Originally Posted By: 2002crownvic
Bigmerc96 I just remembered that several months ago I replaced the shocks on my wife's 2000 Montero sport with kyb's all around and the funny thing with that car is that it doesn't have any type of spring in the front only shocks holding up the weight and they are stiff for that car. They are the gr2 and not the gas a justs.I compressed the shocks before installing them and were pretty easy to compress. How is it possible for the shocks to hold l that weight up?


are you sure it doesn't have torsion bar suspension? is it 4WD?

edit: yup torsion bars


Edited by Wags4000 (02/14/14 03:35 PM)
_________________________
2003 CVLX; 312k mi (perch 103k); P74; Black Paint/Black leather; Blinking side marker mod; 2.73 open dif; Autolite Dbl Plat; General Altimax RT43; LCM Ext relay, FRPP mani; Max-Life 5w-30


03 Crown Victoria LX by Wags4000, on Flickr

2001 Merc GM LS; RIP at 340k mi (bought at 67k)-my former commuter. Finally passed on due to no one driving it and things just stopped working.

1986 Merc GM LS; 165k mi (bought at 118k)- Red with White vinyl half roof; 5.0L; RIP
87 Caprice Wagon; 356k; 5.0L(307cu) RIP

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#2809922 - 02/14/14 04:29 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: Wags4000]
2002crownvic Offline
n00b

Registered: 07/11/12
Posts: 47
Loc: Los Angeles
Do know which monroes you have on the DD and does your car sag in the back with passengers?

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#2809934 - 02/14/14 05:16 PM Re: SHOCKS [Re: 2002crownvic]
therealdnewton3 Offline
Member

Registered: 09/25/13
Posts: 221
Loc: Indianapolis
Shocks primary control concept is not to level or suspend anything; they dampen road force undulation and resist resonant frequency oscilation in suspension components.

The civilian shocks/struts are soft for a reason; this car was sold to old folks primarily. The cop shocks/struts are firm for LE duty. There is not much in between unless you seek out a custom package or buy a tuneable shock/strut.

Each brand (KYB, Gabs, Monroe, etc) probably has a slightly bit different tuning for each application, but the only way to really compare/contrast them would be to use several sets back-to-back on the same car over a series of controlled testing. That pretty much excludes about every comment here in this thread.

If it's too soft (floaty may be the world you seek) for you, then you'll need to either step up to CVPI stuff, or pay out the nose for a custom tuned system.

If it's draggin' it's rear when you load it down, you need to either get stiffer springs, or air bags.
_________________________
HIS: 2007 Grand Marquis LS with CVPI struts/shocks & 29mm/17mm sway bars with stock springs (an excellent compromise for handling and ride!)

HERS: 2005 Grand Marquis LS with stock struts/shocks with 26mm/15mm sway bar (less control than mine but more than stock, however it has heated seats so the rest does not matter to her!)

SON'S: 2006 CVLX; pending suspension upgrades

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