Like any good coach, I'll stay on the sideline and call in the plays. You can take the hits. WALK IT OFF, SON!

The wx has been unfriendly as of late. Rained most of last week. The only break we had forecasted was a relatively short window on Saturday, mid-day. The wet stuff would then continue for a few more days afterwards. I noted that a 2008 GMQ was new to one of the yards. Wanting to source an answer to the brake line issue, I decided that I would take advantage of this window to see what could be had. As fortune would have it (and despite large scale front end damage, the brake line "pack" near the HCU on this particular GMQ had the correct line orientation and fitting sizes so as to match what was in Ol' Blue. Therefore I snatched that out right quick:


It will need a little massaging to re-orient to the non-crash position, but not much. I haven't verified that this will be the answer by attempting to install it in Ol' Blue just yet, but it appeared to be an answer. So I went with it. TBD.

Then a sidebar arose. Yup, this GMQ had the aftermarket moon roof installed. Well that was unplanned! Hmmmmm...what to do? You might recall that I mentioned that Webasto is out of the aftermarket moon roof business. I also mentioned that I'd yank any assembly I encountered solely for the purpose of having plenty of spares. For that reason I felt that I had to live up to my word, even though that wasn't why I went to the yard. To complicate matters the aforementioned window was closing, as the wx began to show up. Again. 'Turned on the afterburners and had everything out in 10 minutes:


Most all of it anyway. Unfortunately I didn't have any drill bits with me, so I couldn't separate the trim ring from the trim support ring. I'll have to make another trip for that at some point in the near future if I want to bring that home as well. That said, I like the headliner opening surround that I found on this unit, so I may just put it to work in Ol' Blue. TBD. However spares are good, so it was worth the effort. I headed out and loaded the day's haul into Da Beast. As I was pulling out of the yard, the heavens opened up. It's been on-and-off since. Good timing (fortuitous is more like it, but hey...)

Family stuff would consume the remainder of the day and night. And so that trip was all I could get-done for the day. Today was a tad different however. I had an entire afternoon I could spend in the workshop and so out I went. 'Decided to polish off the axle sub-project (thanks again Stu! ). That didn't go as smoothly as I would have liked, but it happens. More on that in a bit. I'm a-gonna discuss Panther rear axle stuff now. That may be old hat for many of you. If so, look away. This is more for those who might not be as familiar with it.

The objective is to replace the wheel bearings and axle seals on each side. To do that you must remove the axles. And to do that you must start inside the pumpkin. So I unfastened the 10 bolts and pried off the cover. 'Good news was that I seriously doubt that I would have encountered a leak. It didn't wanna come off. Good.

The first item in the process is to remove the pinion shaft bolt:


It's 8mm, but you'll likely need a wobbly or a low profile socket to deal with it. So you remove that:


Push the pinion shaft through on one side and rotate the assembly so that you can remove it on the other:


It's snug but removes without noticeable effort:


Once you have removed your axles, you typically will reinstall this shaft and run the bolt in finger tight. However I planned on cleaning them, so I just set them aside. The LSD spring would hold everything in place. You then push the axle inward as far as it'll go so that you bring the C-clip into view:


Remove that:


And set it aside. You can then remove the axle by sliding it out of the axle housing:


You'll want to inspect it for wear, especially where it rides on the bearing:


These looked alright, as they had no grooving and showed normal wear. I have a couple of backup shafts that I pulled from a CVPI during one of the salvage yard runs, but these are re-usable and so I'll go with them. That done, I gave them the Brakekleen treatement:


Especially in the bearing area of the shaft. As a side note, you'll need to remove the parking brake assembly in order to slide the shaft in far enough to remove the C-clips. At least on the LSD unit you will. In our case, I need to replace the shoes anyway, so not a problem. Drum type of brakes are fairly similar in implementation, and you might be quite familiar with them. This is a quick rundown of how they work in the Panthers. Note that all of this can be done without any brake-related speciality tools. The shoes themselves are held in place by two springs, one on the upper portion of each shoe:


And are easily removed:


There is a pin that runs from the inner side of the backing plate that holds these springs in position:


With those undone, the simplest way to remove the entire lot is to remove the upper return spring, separate the shoes at the top and pull the assembly down and off. The adjuster will come out with it, though you'll need to separate the parking brake cable from its receptor at the bottom. Anyway this is the rough arrangement of what you'll find:


Not a big task. Installation is the opposite of removal. Kinda fiddly, but not too bad all-n-all. Alright. So with the axles removed this is what you'll see:


You can use a small-ish crow bar to remove the seal, being careful not to damage the axle in the process. The best way to remove the bearing is with a slide hammer bearing puller. Straightforward stuff. Once done, this will be the view:


Bust-out the Brakekleen and go to work. Clean off all of the sealant and the bearing race. Use a lint free cloth/napkin and continue cleaning until your napkin comes out without any dirt or grease on it. Then do the typical like-for-like comparison:


And install the bearing and then the seal. You'll want to use RTV or the like on the seal of course. Do so fairly liberally IMHO. The best way to install these is with a bearing driver tool but a large-enough socket or piece of pipe can work too. Installed:


You'll wanna lube the seal lip. I applied grease to both that and the bearings but that's just my choice. Any number of lubrication options will work. At this point I cleaned some of the hardware in the parts washer:


And began the reinstallation of the axle shafts. There is an important note to make here. That is the rubber o-ring in the C-clip groove. Don't damage that thing when you reinstall the C-clip. Unfortunately after they've seen some miles, these o-rings break easily. Both of mine did tonight, thus:
[img]https://i.imgur.com/9ucacy7.jpg[/img]

And that is the aspect of the process that didn't go so well for us tonight. Fortunately I have those two spare axles that I mentioned. So I went for a look-see to determine if those o-rings were re-usable. One was, the other was already broken. Sigh. So I need to source new ones...

And that is where I had to leave it for the night. O-rings. And I might as well source 2 of them and replace both, even though the one axle is already installed using the o-ring from the spare. Boy is this axle gonna need some touch-up paint work once this is done!

ps-Not certain why the last picture in the post isn't showing up. There appears to be a limit of the number of pictures that will be readily visible in any given post. Oh well. Thanks!

Now ain't you glad I'm here?

Thanks Stu. Yeah, as I admitted already, I should have just done this from the beginning. I let the wx lead me down an ill-advised path. The only saving grace to be found along that path was that this work could have been done after installation. 'Easier with the axle removed from the vehicle though.

However the axle stuff is on-hold until I can lay hands on some o-ring replacements. I ordered a couple of generic sets online last night. 'Should be here tomorrow. I decided to take a closer look-see at these critters in order to focus the search once they show up. And for funzzies. As it turns out, these axle groove o-rings have the following dimensions (approximately):



Hopefully there will be a satisfactory replacement in one of the kits. TBD. Mind you, these o-rings that are found in the C-clip groove on the axle are arguably not even needed. Yes, I realize that. They were likely installed at the factory to aid assembly. I'm sure that there are a good number of Ford enthusiasts and mechanics out there who would tell you not to install them. That said, there are others who would tell you the opposite. For me, I'd prefer to have them present and so that is the way I have opted to go.

In other not-so-swuft news, a few days ago I took a punt on some new body mounts/bushings. There was a set on Ebay for $65. It had all 16 that you would need (so the ad stated). They were identical, but I was hoping that they'd work for every point on the frame except the core support (very front). Ahem. Yeah, no. They won't. Of the 16 I think I will be able to use 8 and that's a crossing fingers scenario. There is a size and shape differential in a couple of instances that just cannot be reasonably ignored. A quick rundown...the new mounts/bushings match up to a few of the existing ones in a kinda-ok manner, thus:


And:


Others ... yeah not so much:


And:


Bunk. And of course they don't even somewhat resemble the core support mounts/bushings whatsoever:


Which I knew going-in. So. I'll use what I can out of the set of 16. If anyone has a need for any of these I'll offer them at shipping-only cost. FWIW. 'Guess I will have to reconsider some of the Dorman offerings if I want new mounts/bushings. TBD.

The bright news of the evening came in the form of the brake line "pack" that connects to the HCU. I pulled it off of the wrecked 2008 GMQ on Saturday. Due to that accident, it took a little fettling to correct the orientation of these lines. Once done they fit well and are a replica of what Ol' Blue originally had:


So that's something. One task completed, thumbs-up for that, regardless of how small.

I'm glad you also experienced this. I fought like hell trying to remove the axles on the Marauder until I removed the E-brake. Multiple people told me it was an unnecessary step, but I couldn't figure any other way around it.

Hmmmmmm...well I don't see how you'd remove the C-clip without removing the parking brake assembly, based on my experience with the Ford 8.8. I suspect that an open diff might be do-able in that scenario 'cause the S spring is absent. However I didn't crack open the one that came on Ol' Blue and have already scrapped it, so I won't make any claims one way or another. I still consider myself a Panther newbie and more of a truck guy, but given what I've seen I'll stand by my parking brake assertion. BTW, a quick note regarding the C-clip o-ring business. According to the FSM and what I've read online, the C-clip should be inserted on the "button side" of the groove. That means that the o-ring, if used, should be on the other. I did receive some of the generic, all purpose, grease-compatible o-rings in a kit yesterday. I tried a couple on for size:


However those won't work. With the diameter of the groove and the size of the C-clip, the thickness of the o-ring was too large. I noticed that the ones that came on the axle were what you might refer to as "wider but still thin", if you will. And so I found an o-ring specialty store online last night and ordered a couple of options to try. Based on their numbers associated with those products, one of them should work. TBD. Crazy though: I had to purchase 67 as a minimum, which totalled $1. For each. So that was $2 in product purchase but $8 in shipping! So if anyone wants some of these, I'll ship some to you free of charge... lol

In my previous post I failed to mention that I ordered some of the brake components the other night. I went with middle-to-high end stuff given our use case scenario for Ol' Blue. I did spring for the "police pads" and severe duty rotors up front. In the rear I'll have a set of Powerstop rotors and pads. Finally, a set of Raybestos shoes for the parking brake replacements. The first two of which come in a package with new hardware, so that's to-the-good. I'll need to re-use the parking brake h/w. That's not a big deal though, since all of it was present and in good shape (as it usually is). A little cleaning and they'll be ready to reinstall. Shipping wasn't as bad as I was expecting considering the weight. For that reason I opted for the RockAuto route over local auto parts stores. The shoes arrived tonight:


The other packages should arrive tomorrow. However all of that is still on-hold until I lay hands on the specialty o-rings. They should be here on Friday.

Wanting to continue making progess in the meantime I decided to revisit the frame. It remained in need of paint, so the plan for the night became the tackling of this sub-project. Since almost no one will ever see this I decided that I would put in a decent amount of time in the prep but nothing like I'll need to do upstairs. So it was another quick wash, a scrubbing with a couple of Scotchbrite pads, an acetone cleaning and then paint. I began with the front:


Taking the time to remove the top brackets for the inner fenders to paint separately. After more prep and paint, here is where things ended for the night:


I then left it to dry until tomorrow. After work I'll apply a layer of clear and that'll be that. Thus in the end it'll have one layer of base and one layer of clear. Again, given that it'll almost never be seen and the fact that I'm doing it mostly as a long-term rust preventative measure this approach seems satisfactory. Reasonably anyway.

I've never had to do anything like that, even on limited slip axles. Last fall I replaced axle seals on a 2005 with a limited slip 3.27. Never touched the parking brake.

I have, however, had to remove the ABS sensors, else the tone ring and abs sensor contact and stop the axle moving in enough.

2011LX- Alright, interesting. Thank you for the feedback. I'll see if I have time to conduct a little experiment once I have the new parking brakes installed. You see, I didn't even attempt to remove the C-clip once I saw the limited room to remove it when the parking brakes were installed. Since we need to replace the shoes anyway, I simply skipped to removing those and then revisited the C-clip extraction. The one aspect of this process that I would contend is a definite is that removing the parking brake yields more room through which you can access the C-clip. Thus doing so makes the task easier. That said, you now have me curious so if there are a few minutes to spare I'll see what I can turn-up.

Limited time again tonight, as always these days. The remainder of the new brake components arrived from RockAuto last night and the o-rings from the specialty shop came in today. Thus the first item on the agenda was a-gonna be the axle stuff. I installed one of the new o-rings onto the driver's side shaft followed by the C-clip:


Gheez but was that the perfect fit. The C-clip went right into place with a bit of a push but nothing resembling what was required with the o-rings from the generic kit. This new o-ring held position on the outer portion of the groove even when the C-clip was installed and provided just the right amount of retaining force to hold the clip in position nicely, thus:



I was satisfied with these. So much so that I removed the pax side axle, replaced the original o-ring with another one of the new ones, re-lubricated the lip of the seal and re-installed it. In the end that was a good thing because the original o-ring broke as I removed it from the groove. I digress. So that's that. The axles are set. Next would be the rear brakes and associated h/w.

However I decided to forego that in favor of applying the layer of clear to the frame. I did that and then had to call it a night to get inside for family stuff. Hopefully there will be time to finish off the rear axle tomorrow. TBD.

Hope all is well!

I'm not terribly surprised that you installed the O-rings on the new axles as your attention to detail on this build is...well, high. But, my understanding is that they're simply an assembly aid for the factory, so I didn't put them on the new Marauder axle shafts, and noticed no excessive play or any other issues since.

Yeah from the limited research I did the notion of the C-clip o-ring being an assembly aid appears to be the common understanding. As I stated on the 25th, I am aware if that and I also realize that they aren't required. I opted to reinstall them anyway 'cause that's how I roll. I also had this far-fetched notion that perhaps a secondary reason was that if axle endplay developed due to excessive clutch pack wear - for example - that without the o-rings the C-clip could pop out. However in that same scenario with the o-rings installed, then between those and the pinion shaft those same C-clips would remain in place until a repair was made. That's a s-t-r-e-t-c-h and I realize that also. However given that I am - for all intent and purposes - building this car full well knowing that my family will be its primary occupants, well ... I am compelled to do every last thing I can to make it as safe and reliable as the day it rolled off of the assembly line. Even if it means reinstalling these o-rings. Or so the thought goes. And that's that.

Had limited time today as usual. I decided to spend it heading back out to the yard to retrieve the remaining moon roof components that I didn't have the tools to remove the last time I was there. It's been a week so you never know if the parts you left behind have been taken or damaged by those who follow after you. Thus today's trip was a bit of a roll-of-the-dice. However, the least expensive I've seen the trim support ring is $120 + tax + shipping and the least I've seen the plastic trim ring was $65 + tax + shipping. Thus it seemed a worthy endeavor given how relatively rare the parts themselves are. And so out I went. Fortunately neither the wx nor other yard customers had damaged or removed these critters. I snapped a quick picture to show how the two are riveted together in the aftermarket installation variant:


Nothing that a drill bit cannot remedy. Providing of course that you remember to bring them with you! So in no time at all I had the two items for which I made the trip in-hand:


Due to the wx last weekend, I left the moon roof drain tubes behind as well. They were still present, so fortune was indeed on our side today. This is how the aft moon roof drains should be routed, by the way:


Once back in the workshop I had time only to conduct the lil' experiment that I referenced yesterday. I reinstalled one set of the old shoes:


And shoved the axle in as far as I could. This is what I saw inside the diff:


Now that is much further inward than I remember it being during my original removal attempt. Mind you, I installed only the shoes and their keepers (or springs). I installed none of the return springs, the adjuster nor the cable receptor. However I don't recall those extending outward beyond the shoes. Anyway this little test showed that it was tricky and tight, but that the C-clip could indeed be removed:


With some thin-walled pliars. So I dunno. Again, I don't recall there being that much room when I attempted this on the first go-around. However I simply didn't have time to fully install the new shoes and all of the h/w tonight, so this experiment result will have to stand for the time being. FWIW.

I did give the parking brake and other rear end h/w a bath in the parts washer tonight as well:


The plan is to reassemble all of this lot tomorrow. TBD.

You never seem to have as much time as you think you do or will. That theme resonated for us today. However with what we had, I finished off the parking brake stuff and revisited the stablizer bars. To begin, some of the parking brake components received a quick dash of paint:


Even though it's doubtful that it will last long or do much. The can was sitting out, so ... eh. Anyway, the parking brake thing is done:


And so we're moving on. I had plans of working on the A-arms 'n such but noticed the stabilizer bars sitting outside the workshop. And so I decided to tackle those instead. This was supposed to be a quick diversion type of task but ended up requiring more time than it should, mostly because I had lil' un watching duties today while the wife-eee was out shopping. I also got distracted by the front bar mounts, but more on that in a minute. First the decision regarding which of the 4 that I had on-hand to use. I opted to go with the recipe that I mentioned a short while ago: use the front bar from the 2003 CVPI but replace the rear bar that came with the 2010 CVPI rear axle with the one that was on Ol' Blue. The reason being that the ones I chose each had a slightly larger diameter, respectively, than their counterparts. And that difference can be appreciable, depending. Therefore this is the route I elected to take.

That done, the next step was to prep and paint these critters. There was a fair amount of grease on the front bar that I removed from the 2003 CVPI last weekend, so I contended with that first. Neither bar had much rust, mostly just dirt. And so they cleaned up well enough to apply non-rusty-metal primer:


And then paint:


So that's to-the-good. Now for those mounts on the front stabilizer bar that came from the 2003 CVPI. I touched on this briefly in a previous post. However the difference has me indeed curious. Why are the mounts different from those that came on the front bar of Ol' Blue? Thus:


Anyone know? You can clearly discern a weld bead that joins the sleeve to the mounting bracket:


This has me intrigued enough that I consulted the 2006 manual. It shows the type of front stabilizer bar mounts that were present on Ol' Blue:


Granted, that picture is from a 2006 manual, so who knows? The 2003 equivalent might contain an illustration depicting the type that I found on the 2003 CVPI. Ergo, that might have been "the norm" for that model year (and perhaps beyond). 'Just dunno. I had wanted to replace these but I see no means of removing them short of cutting them off. I suppose that if you could (somehow) force them to slide along the bar you might be able to simply remove them off of each respective end. However these are firmly, solidly in place. So in the end, I decided that since only the ends of the rubber bushing show any signs of wear (slight cracking) that I would just apply some restorer to them and see how they clean up. Therefore I covered them with painter's tape prior to applying the primer and paint to the remainder of the bar. We'll see if that formula works. TBD.

My guess with the sway bar bushings:

-With the "old" way, the bushings are non serviceable and a failure means throwing the entire thing in the garbage. If a bushing fails, replace the entire bar/bushing assembly. $$$$

Perhaps there were complaints or Ford just determined that this is moronic.

-The "new" way is much more traditional (the way it's been for a century), where when a bushing fails, you cut it off and replace with a new one. The new one is manufactured with a slice through one side of it to allow you to snap it over the bar. The clamp then squeezes it tight.

Well that was my guess too. Then I thought "ah, surely not..." and then thought "...it wouldn't be the first time an automotive manufacturer did something boneheaded only to subsequently correct it." So perhaps that's the way it played out. I'd like to lay hands on a 2003 - 2005 FSM so that I could see if this was indeed the case. The other possibility that arose when I gave it a couple of cycles was that perhaps it was a CVPI-only component. Since those cars are roughed up quite often in comparison, maybe it wasn't viewed as being much of an issue to replace the entire front stabilizer bar rather than just the bushings. However, if that *was* their view, they changed their minds at some point in the future, 'cause The 5-O has the same design as shown in the above diagram from the 2006 FSM. I digress...

Well. The game plan is a-gonna be to run with this stabilizer bar variant for the time being. If at some point during a future salvage yard run I find an equivalent-in-diameter bar on a newer CVPI with the updated mount design, I'll snatch that and replace this one from the 2003. TBD.

Found picture of this variant installed on another 2003 CVPI:


Interesting.

You're not fooling me, Jerry. All this sway-bar bushing discussion is an attempt to deflect attention from the real issue:



You painted the axle again.

Bwaaahahahahaha! Although the sway bar business was a sincere investigation/question that was presented/posed to the forum, I was wondering if 1) you would notice the darker tint on the axle housing and backing plate and then 2) if you'd mention anything if you did. 'Shoulda known that the answer is 'yes' on both accounts. Can't sneak anything past the Stu-meister!

In short, you are correct. I did paint the axle housing, again. I dunno fellas, the blue choice was just "too much bling" for my tastes. Since those are a subjective creature, I can't tell ya why. It just was/is. So after a scrub down and cleaning on went the black. However, I decided to attempt to be original-somewhat by taking a two-tone approach. I decided to leave the diff itself in Navy Blue, thus:


Somehow that seemed less bling-eee to me, though arguably it is even more so. Pointless to discuss let alone argue subjective matters of taste really; thus I'll leave it at that. I'm trying this on for size. If I like it, it'll stay. If not then the pumpkin goes black too. TBD. Unfortunately the cover was in not-so-hot shape when I got it and even after a thorough cleaning and prep it didn't take well to the paint:


So I dunno what I'll do here. Considering just leaving it as a good-enough result and calling it a day. TBD.

Alright. After installing the parking brakes on both sides, I decided to revisit this can-I-remove-the-C-clip-with-the-parking-brake-stuff-still-mounted business. Just a quick experiment to attempt to arrive at a definitive answer. At first, with the axle pushed inward as far as it wanted to go, this is what I saw:


And it is this that I recall seeing back whenever it was. You won't remove the C-clip in this configuration. I rotated the carrier to have a better look at the underside of the clip, thus:


Yup, that won't be removed. Good to see that the groove's o-ring is correctly oriented and doing well though. I digress.

So. I played around with the axle a bit, rotating it slightly, attempting to push it further inward. What I found was that there was indeed a position that if you happened to find, then you could push the axle in far enough with the shoes on to remove the C-clip. And so that is where I left it: IMHO it can be done but I had to fiddle with it in order to slide the shaft in far enough to remove that clip. FWIW. YMMV.

With the experimentation concluded, I pushed the axle outdoors, mounted a couple of tires and gave the inside of the diff a thorough cleaning with good ol' BrakeKleen.


Then had to call it a night to help with family stuff.

Take care!