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#4095036 - 02/06/21 06:46 AM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
Old_Guy_Stu Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 04/28/19
Posts: 1953
Loc: Cleveland, OH
Two-tone ain't bad. But honestly, who's ever going to see it once you get the body back on?
_________________________

1988 CVLX Formal Roof (Love Boat) POTM July 2019 & Aug 2020, 55K
E-code lights w/ relays, LEDs w/ switchbacks, 15x8 Ansen slots w/ 255/60 BFG's, Kenwood stereo, various hacks.
1988 CVLX (Destroyer) 1998-2001 driven to death 202K
1988 Squire (Chris Craft) 1996-1998 junkyard rescue driven to death 199K

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#4095060 - 02/06/21 01:15 PM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: 2011LX]
2004_p71 Offline

no replacement for displacement
Posting Addict

Registered: 09/04/03
Posts: 15679
Loc: Quebec Canada
Originally Posted By 2011LX
I've never had to do anything like that, even on limited slip axles. Last fall I replaced axle seals on a 2005 with a limited slip 3.27. Never touched the parking brake.

I have, however, had to remove the ABS sensors, else the tone ring and abs sensor contact and stop the axle moving in enough.



Same here.
I must have done dozens of diff job on panther and never had to mess around with the parking brake to remove and axle but you have to align the wheel studs by rotation the axle to clear the parking brake system .
_________________________


new best time 13.079 @ 105 1.8 60'

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#4095152 - 02/06/21 11:43 PM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: Old_Guy_Stu]
av8or1 Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 10/18/17
Posts: 1396
Loc: TX
Originally Posted By Old_Guy_Stu
Two-tone ain't bad. But honestly, who's ever going to see it once you get the body back on?

Fair-'nuff question. The answer is that I'll see it. I'll know what's there. When you build a car at this level you know most every nut-n-bolt. In the case of the all-blue axle, each time I would have needed to remove the wheel for whatever reason, bleed the brakes, change the shock, etc. then I'd see the navy blue. Mostly because of the backing plate, mind you. The axle housing and diff you'd see much less of course. So with this two-tone approach it seemed like a bit of a compromise between the two. Just enough bling to make it kinda-sorta-unique-ish but not so much that I'd see it each time I did something with one of the rear wheels or tires. Or so the thought goes...

Originally Posted By 2004_p71
Same here.
I must have done dozens of diff job on panther and never had to mess around with the parking brake to remove and axle but you have to align the wheel studs by rotation the axle to clear the parking brake system .

Yeah as I stated this was the conclusion that I came to after doing some experimenting. I found that I had to get the axle situated just right in order to slide it in far enough though. Anyway it can be done, yes.

I decided to take a break from the axle today, primarily because of how unhappy I am with the outcome of the diff cover. I decided to o'er leap just a bit to the next item on the agenda, which is the bushing replacement business. I reckon that we might as well change them while we're here. In preparation for this work effort, I treated myself to a middle-of-the-road bearing removal kit. Admittedly I've grown weary of the back-n-forth to "rent" a set "for free" from a local auto parts store. That's a more-than-good solution mind you, nothing wrong with it. Just wanted to get a set of my own. Anyway I began with the ball joint on the pax side lower control arm. That thing fought me more than expected. My battery powered 1/2" DeWalt impact, which is a beast of cordless impact wrenches by all standards, was no match. The vice wasn't enough either. So I temporarily re-mounted it to the frame for additional bracing/support. That provided only so much rigidity because the frame remains on jack stands. That said, the frame's overall weight did yield just enough support to drive the ball joint out of its seat. By the time all was said and done I needed the frame for support, a 1/2" cheater bar and a cheater extension to free the critter:


But it came out, no problem. 'Gonna begin looking online tonight for new replacement h/w. 'Prolly go with RockAuto again, as they've been delivering well as of late. Anyway if anyone has any suggestions of stuff they've used and therefore recommend, I'm open to suggestion.

Take care!


Edited by av8or1 (02/06/21 11:52 PM)
_________________________
2010 CVPI (Former TEXAS Highway Patrol vehicle) POTM April 2020 double thumbs
2006 LX Sport air ride delete (2)
2006 F450 SD 6.0L PSD CC LWB flatbed 4x4
1985 Mazda RX7 GSL-SE
1970 Plymouth Road Runner A383 pistol grip tick-tock buckets

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#4095174 - 02/07/21 11:09 AM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
av8or1 Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 10/18/17
Posts: 1396
Loc: TX
In the interest of full disclosure with the notion of so-doing being to assist anyone who might attempt such endeavor in the future, I am posting links to the parts I've used during this build. The caveat being of course that there must be a link to be had. Many of the parts I've used thus far, in the engine in particular, came from the dealership. For those I supplied a picture of the OEM part numbers.

Anyway, I meant to do this at the time I purchased these parts but am getting 'round to it just now. Finally, I figure that if I'm making inquiries regarding parts recommendations that I oughta offer equal information regarding the parts I've used.

So. The stuff for the rear axle:
Rear Axle Bearing
Rear Axle Seal

Front brakes:
Police Package Front Rotors and Pads

Rear brakes:
Rear Rotors and Pads

Parking Brake Shoes:
Raybestos (shoes only)


Edited by av8or1 (02/07/21 02:49 PM)
_________________________
2010 CVPI (Former TEXAS Highway Patrol vehicle) POTM April 2020 double thumbs
2006 LX Sport air ride delete (2)
2006 F450 SD 6.0L PSD CC LWB flatbed 4x4
1985 Mazda RX7 GSL-SE
1970 Plymouth Road Runner A383 pistol grip tick-tock buckets

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#4095272 - 02/07/21 08:54 PM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
av8or1 Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 10/18/17
Posts: 1396
Loc: TX
Managed to find a little time to attempt to continue to make progress on Ol' Blue today. I decided that it was time to finalize whatever I was a-gonna do WRT the paint on the diff cover. One way or the other. Either take it back to bare metal or leave it as-is. I opted to take a somewhere-in-the-middle path by doing a little sanding, cleaning, more sanding, more cleaning and finally applying what would be the last touch of paint. So fellas, this is where I'm a-gonna leave it:


It's an ok-ish-from-5-feet-away job. For an axle that is acceptable, and so that's that. Note that I haven't completed the final assembly and lube yet. In the above picture the cover remains in letting-the-paint-dry mode. Assuming it is alright to handle, I plan on finishing off the diff tomorrow after work. TBD.

While that was proceeding, I moved on to the front suspension bushings, etc. I began with the pax side lower control arm:


With the objective being to remove the front bushing. Using the new-fangled bearing removal kit, this was the configuration:


Which removed it rather easily:


Then came the driver's side lower control arm. Like the one on the pax side, it needed to be temporarily re-mounted to the frame in order to obtain enough leverage to force the ball joint out:


Or at least the above is how I went about it. When removing these critters, you will occasionally need to get a tad creative in order to make things happen. This remounting to the frame was but one example of such creativity. Anyway that done, I moved on to the upper control arm ball joints. My initial configuration:


However that didn't work, as there wasn't enough room for the ball joint to drop out of the bottom with that arrangement of the pieces-parts. There also wasn't enough pressure being applied to the joint to remove it, as the only sleeve from the kit that was long enough to fit over the mount was a tad too large in diameter. And so I switched horses to an old 1 1/8" socket that I had laying around. That was up to the task:


Last but not least were the bushings on the upper control arms. They were rather trivial to remove:


Skipping ahead, the front suspension of Ol' Blue is now this:


So now the task becomes navigating to RockAuto to pick-up replacements. I'll post links regarding which options I elect to go-with. And of course I will need to clean and paint the arms in the meantime. I'm considering an all-out replacement of the rear control arms with new ones. As I recall you can get the lot of them in one bundle. The price didn't seem outrageous, so we'll see.

Y'all take care, hope all is well!


Edited by av8or1 (02/07/21 09:11 PM)
_________________________
2010 CVPI (Former TEXAS Highway Patrol vehicle) POTM April 2020 double thumbs
2006 LX Sport air ride delete (2)
2006 F450 SD 6.0L PSD CC LWB flatbed 4x4
1985 Mazda RX7 GSL-SE
1970 Plymouth Road Runner A383 pistol grip tick-tock buckets

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#4095308 - 02/08/21 08:11 AM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
2011LX Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 1369
Loc: SE WI
A little bit of advice for the future:

Rather than cranking on the press tool to remove/install the ball joints, turn the forcing screw until it gets tight, then firmly rap the control arm @ the ball joint a few times with a mallet. The shock and vibration around the ball joint will straighten/settle it. You'll be able to drive the ball joints out without killing it with cheater pipes and brute force, potentially breaking things.

Same method works for pressing any interference fit parts.
_________________________
2011 Crown Victoria LX - purchased @ 37k miles
currently @ 100k miles
Dark Toreador Red Metallic exterior
Medium Light Stone interior

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#4095320 - 02/08/21 10:21 AM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
av8or1 Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 10/18/17
Posts: 1396
Loc: TX
Thank you for the feedback 2011LX. Yeah, I did the hammering thing too, just didn't mention it in the post(s) because it didn't help. At least not in this case it didn't. I still needed the cheater. It happens that way sometimes... laugh

Alright so the one thing about RockAuto that I've never really liked is the lack of customer support. I understand that the concept is to not provide that service in order to provide lower prices. Still, it would help if there was at least email support of some kind. 'Is what it is. The question I have isn't about how to use their website or anything along those lines. It's a "what's in the box" type of inquiry. And the candidate in question is the forward bushing for the front lower control arms. This is the one I decided to go with:

Front Lower Control Arm Bushing

And the question is "how many are there"? I mean the RockAuto help page states that parts are sold individually. Ok fine. However the picture shows two of them. The description doesn't state how many (unlike some other products) and even further states that the color is black. The picture indicates otherwise. Thus there is a conflict between the guidance offered by the help section and the product information itself. If I need two of these, exactly what do I order? Frig. Well, to play it conservatively, I ordered a quantity of 1, opting to go with the information that the picture would seem to intuitively convey. If that isn't the case and I need another bushing, I suppose that I can order it. Granted, there will be an additional shipping cost if I have to go that route, but it is less hassle than a return. Or so the thought goes. And in the abstract, how many of y'all have returned something to RockAuto? I've ordered a good amount from them in the past but as luck would have it I've never had to return anything. And so I have no experience with that process.

For completion, the following is the remainder of what I ordered in regard to the new suspension components for Ol' Blue:

Front Upper Control Arm Bushings
Front Upper Control Arm Ball Joint
Front Lower Control Arm Ball Joint
Driver's Side Front Lower Control Arm Aft Bushing
Pax Side Front Lower Control Arm Aft Bushing
Rear Upper Control/Trailing Arm
Rear Lower Control/Trailing Arm
Watts Link

I decided to buy new front control arm aft bushings rather than reuse the ones that I found on Ol' Blue. One of them would have been alright to reinstall but the other had a crack in the bushing. Although small now, it would only worsen. Granted, that would likely require some time prior to becoming a concern. However, we're here. Access will never be better. So just replace it all with new...

Thanks!


Edited by av8or1 (02/08/21 11:56 AM)
_________________________
2010 CVPI (Former TEXAS Highway Patrol vehicle) POTM April 2020 double thumbs
2006 LX Sport air ride delete (2)
2006 F450 SD 6.0L PSD CC LWB flatbed 4x4
1985 Mazda RX7 GSL-SE
1970 Plymouth Road Runner A383 pistol grip tick-tock buckets

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#4095486 - 02/09/21 11:45 AM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
Packman Offline
Climber

Registered: 01/17/07
Posts: 830
Loc: Joisey
I did the same thing to my '86 rear rebuild that you did with your rear axle rebuild. I gutted and cleaned the inside; then cleaned and painted the axle tubes and pumpkin in the back yard; I did exactly what you did with black axle tubes and Ford dark blue pumpkin. Then brought it in for the rebuild. Found out to my dismay that I couldn't carry a fully loaded rear axle back out of the basement LOL It looked good for a few months; but my ailing 5.0 lopo spewed oil all over the trans, undercarriage, and rear axle in short order.

I rebuilt the front suspension shortly after installing the rear axle. I used the same press that you used. Made removing the ball joints so much easier. I tried pressing the bushings out and discovered that I needed to drill many holes to break-up the rubber before pressing them out. I've used that press for other unrelated tasks with success; so it's definitely not a waste of money to purchase it outright.
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Bop Your head and stomp your feet!
Droppin' it nicely, droppin' it neat!

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#4095664 - 02/09/21 11:11 PM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
av8or1 Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 10/18/17
Posts: 1396
Loc: TX
Packman- Interesting story regarding your 86 rear axle. I don't expect the paint job to last long either. I did it mostly for reasons involving rust prevention and longetivity. Added a touch of bling in the end just because. laugh I agree, having your own tools is usually the best option. I found this particular bearing removal set for a little over $100, continued shopping and found the identical set on Ebay for $85 shipped. So it seemed like a reasonable deal. 'Course the plastic case that it came in broke the first day, or the latches did that is. So I quicky-fabbed a box from spare 16 ga plate I had laying around, then mounted that box on the top of my HF hydraulic press. And I did that because my toolboxes are full-to-the-brim. lol I digress.

Well fellas the weather in Central TEXAS is supposed to worsen for the next week or so. We've been experiencing the normal TEXAS weather of temps in the 60s n 70s. That's as cold as I'd like to see it become, but alas no. Anyway the point being that I decided to get my carcass out to the workshop this evening. The priority was painting the suspension components since it'll soon be too cold to paint. Last night I drove to the old-school car wash and gave them a hot soapy bath. Tonight they received a scuffing and an acetone cleaning. This was the first coat of gloss black:


Applied two coats then waited. Dried enough-ish to flip them over and do the backsides too:


I then turned my attention to the rear diff. Stu didn't show up to assist with the removal of the RTV (hah! I enjoy ribbing Stu - it's all in good fun in case you weren't aware BTW) but I expected as much. Anyway I cleaned all of that off of the diff:


And the cover:


Applied RTV liberally and sinched it down. Then the show began. The FSM calls for 33 ft-lbs. However prior to that point two of the ever-mother-lovin-friggin bolt heads decided that they didn't want to play nicey-nice any longer. And subsequently broke off. rolleyes

The others did just fine, so I'm not certain why these two in particular went South. Sigh. Oh well, that's another minor PITA that I'll have to contend with. Fortunately they were both on the lower half, which means that they were mounted on top of the bottom cover support. Therefore if I can't lay pliars on them as-is then I can pop that support off and have better access. I may tackle that tomorrow prior to the "real cold" arriving. TBD.

Take care!
_________________________
2010 CVPI (Former TEXAS Highway Patrol vehicle) POTM April 2020 double thumbs
2006 LX Sport air ride delete (2)
2006 F450 SD 6.0L PSD CC LWB flatbed 4x4
1985 Mazda RX7 GSL-SE
1970 Plymouth Road Runner A383 pistol grip tick-tock buckets

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#4095702 - 02/10/21 07:02 AM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
Old_Guy_Stu Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 04/28/19
Posts: 1953
Loc: Cleveland, OH
One of these days I really will show up and nit-pick you to death. That'll show ya.
_________________________

1988 CVLX Formal Roof (Love Boat) POTM July 2019 & Aug 2020, 55K
E-code lights w/ relays, LEDs w/ switchbacks, 15x8 Ansen slots w/ 255/60 BFG's, Kenwood stereo, various hacks.
1988 CVLX (Destroyer) 1998-2001 driven to death 202K
1988 Squire (Chris Craft) 1996-1998 junkyard rescue driven to death 199K

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#4095724 - 02/10/21 08:07 AM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: av8or1]
2011LX Offline
Over the Hill

Registered: 08/31/13
Posts: 1369
Loc: SE WI
WOW, 33Ft lbs on those cover bolts?

Seems excessive, like a misprint.

First of all, those bolts aren't that big.

Secondly, that's merely a stamped steel cover that bends and warps easily.

Third, it's a freaking cover. All it needs to do is mate to the housing, squish the RTV out. Tighten to snug and "a little more" should be plenty.

Good thing you used RTV that can be displaced. If you used a paper gasket and cranked them down to 33 ft lbs, I bet you'd have bent the cover!
_________________________
2011 Crown Victoria LX - purchased @ 37k miles
currently @ 100k miles
Dark Toreador Red Metallic exterior
Medium Light Stone interior

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#4095912 - 02/10/21 10:40 PM Re: Jerry's Crown Victorias [Re: Old_Guy_Stu]
av8or1 Offline

Over the Hill

Registered: 10/18/17
Posts: 1396
Loc: TX
Originally Posted By Old_Guy_Stu
One of these days I really will show up and nit-pick you to death. That'll show ya.
rofl

Yeah 2011LX, I concur with your position and thought the same type of thing when I looked up that number in the FSM. However it was verified online as well, so... I went with it. I doubt I'll do that again though. Don't want to break any more of these critters. So I'll give the snug++ ("snug-plus-plus") approach a go and cross fingers that there will be no leaks...

And speaking of the cruft, it was irking me enough that I didn't want to delay attempting resolution. So out to the workshop I went tonight after work. Here was the quasi-aftermath:


Frig. I couldn't determine just how far down the break on the bolt stem was, so I removed the rear cover support:


To discover that the break was just below that surface. On both accounts. Frig! The orange that you see in the above picture is the rusty metal primer BTW, not rust. Well, ok so maybe this won't be all bad then. Perhaps I can get pliars on them if I remove the cover (again), which I don't want to do:


Nope, there just isn't enough of the stem remaining above the surface to latch onto. FRIG! Oh well. Fortunately I still had the remnants of a bolt extractor kit in the old tool box. So I pulled that out and went to work. There's one:


And two:


Thus on the bright side they did come out without damaging the diff. Sure, I'll need to re-do the RTV but that's a much better result than needing a new diff! That said, what to do regarding replacement bolts? Fortunately I had an answer for that. As it turns out, I decided to remove three of them off of the axle that came on Ol' Blue for just such an occasion. I would not have imagined that I would have needed them, but as events would have it, I did. So I dug through several freezer bags until I had found a couple of replacements:


These need a cleaning and blue paint, but are otherwise ready to install. However prior to doing anything else on this subtask, I brought out the big guns: the large tap & die set:


And went-to-town on both the diff and the bolts that go into it. 'Prolly should have done that prior to this last install. I did check them and they seemed alright to re-use as they were. And 8 of them did work just fine. So again, not sure why these two in particular opted to call-it-quits ... but they did. Meh in the end no harm, no foul. Just a short diversion. All's well that ends well.

Not sure when I'll revisit this, as the wx is supposed to close in on us tomorrow. 'Made certain that all of the outdoor faucets are covered, etc. and then came back inside to help get the lil' un to sleep.

Y'all take care, hope all is well!


Edited by av8or1 (02/10/21 10:44 PM)
_________________________
2010 CVPI (Former TEXAS Highway Patrol vehicle) POTM April 2020 double thumbs
2006 LX Sport air ride delete (2)
2006 F450 SD 6.0L PSD CC LWB flatbed 4x4
1985 Mazda RX7 GSL-SE
1970 Plymouth Road Runner A383 pistol grip tick-tock buckets

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